Gover Inforri
Unit Progr(
. Date: n men?
iati on 24l: M T R ANSC RIPi1
~ rk Day
Ith Mdarchi, 1982-. comonwoi4th GOweKaw~ i Ottim-&
4 Traevwy F1m,
Broadcast VIG: 3AW
INTERVIEW WITH P~ RII'tE MiNISTER
LY
Today I'm pleased to havie the Prime Nk. nister Rr. Fraser as a
guest. on t: his piogram. I'm pleased because it's a most timely
interview, For-quite a few~ days nbw;' we've been askilig J4r. r-raser
to talk. -to us, because the Victorian State election is Just.
over a week away, . a nd we thought he mig~ ht have some things to
say on that. Houzing is a central--:, issue i11n this election,
andl the -action -f Mr, Pxraser's Goveram'ent last week, in
announcingj assistance for homebuyers would hAve in the niormal
*-course-of things, helped the Thompson Governtment in its
ff ighf. foK re-election', but perhaps it won't, because at the
ame time as therederal Government announced it would help,
it also announced that it ' had set in t'rain a 1 tper'cent rise
in the coEst of home loans9.. And while ' the ' Victorian -Government
moved swiftly'to coanter that w~ ith its home interest subsidy
scheme mar-k2, the consensus of-political comment~ itoL's seemis-to
be that the Federal* Go'ernj-ent's action could hurt rather than
help Mr. Thompson. So we'll cove! r all that ground with
Mx. Fraser. Blut it's particularly timely today that we're
* talking because t he whole town's withf speoulation,. started
with morning by The Age and splashed toniolit in the Herald that
Mr. Anldriw Peacociz is preparing to . make a run against M1r. Fraser.
On the line I have the man himself, the Prime Minister of
Autralia, Rr. Malcolm Fraser, goodafternoon.
PRIRPE IMINISTER:
Good af ternfoon to you.. 2/
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DAY:
mr. F-raser do you expect a challenge from Andrew Peacock?
PRIM4E MINISTER:
V'o I don't.
DAY:
Would you ( laughs) well, that sort of takes-the wind out of my
sails does~ n't it? it's been suggested that you might not
object to a spill, that you have the nurnheris. and Mr. Peacocli
hasn't, an~ d it's to your advantage to let him have a tilt at:
your crown and lose, thereby-
PRI61E MINISTER:
Well : 1 think it's particularly' unfortunate,, and I think it's
Herald.. I heard you referred to it, and you know, the run-up
period to the Victorian election, because they are state
__ issues anei this election in Victoria is going to be won on
those issues, and quite obviously, stability and whatever is
going to be helpfal to Lindsay Thompson in that period.
DAY:
Well why eto you think this speculation might have started at
this Point?
PRIME MINI: STER:
Well you'dt have to ask somebody else that.
DAY:
ILa~ i. Last week you
PRIME-MNISTER:
Really, there are major jobs, major tasks in Government to be done.
Quite obviously Australia faces problems. I suppose the
Government or a country always does. 13ut there are very
-Particular problems at the moment, some of them are home growni,
and some are generated from events from overseas, arid you know-,
our tash is to get on * ana do thle beqt job we possibly can. .3/
DAY: But nevertheless there are polit
I you of all, people are aware of*,
and othe r observors to-b~ e distar
result whatever it may be. ; ical realities which I'm sure
and last week, you seemed to MO
ioi-yourself from the Victorian
PRI61S MINI: STER:
I don't think so, no. I'd been aske-d a question about somethinlg,
and it happens to be true that: for the f irst time that I can
recall there are people trylnq', to say that tlie-State. eleetion
is -for better or f or worse,. is the f ault of thh Federal Government.
Now demon~ strably that' a not so. I believe that Lindsay
Thompson is going to win, and wiin very well. But the factstill
remains. People have voted ni election after an election,
one way for Federal issues.. another way for State issues.
You know, you could give examples, whether it's from New
South Wales, fromn Victoria, or; from Tasmania, where the Labor
Party are going to get booted right out whenever there's an
election, and I think I was saying I find it very hard to
understand why there seems to be a morbid determination amongst
part of the media to say that whatever happens inl V. ictoria
is of the consequence of Malcolm Fraser. They unfortunately
know that-that's not so, and so does Victoria. Victoria wins,
they win on State issues and not on Federal issues, and I'm sure
you'd agree with that.
DAY,. Yes, itake your point and I think you make the point well, but
nevertheless there is still, page 1 lead of the Melbourne Her~ td
tonight d& rawing a line between a possible Liberal loss in
Victoria andl a Peacock challenge to you. Now you say You don't
think it will happen. You may'.% ell be right,. but the speculation
is there, and it's my job to afik you for your reaction to it.
PRIME MI1tN) STER:
I tlhin^-I've given it to you haven't I?
I4. DAY;
Yes, you donl. t expect ( laughs) ' to, have a challen ge.
How damaging is it for you though to be looking over your
shoulder. all the time?
PRIM4E MINISTER:
Well I'm ' not.. but it's fair-enough 1-thimk to make-the point
that the job of Government is. vastly important. ] People of
Liberal p'hilosophy and Liberalideas have cerain ideas of what
we want for the future ofAustralia, for the kind of lives that:
people can lead, the sort of opportunities we want to have
available for Australian families, and for young. Australians
in*-partic-ular, and we k~ now that there are problems in front
of us, there are problems in front of all the major industrial.
countries arourid the world, and fcrmotst of them,. their
difficulties are muich, much greater than ours, and so whatever
might be happening in the rear I find that I'm fully preoccupied
with the bu. 9iness of Government, and I intend to keep
-it that way#
DAY: I tn, All right. Thank you for that. Let's move on to the
homres issae, which together with financial management has
dominated -the Victorian campaign. Your Governmerit was
criticiced yesterday by what was see-n-bymotoerrsa
a blatant assistance to theVictorian Liberals over your
advertisements for your new home tax rebate scheme.
PRIIAS MINrSTER:
Well I thought that you just said that it should be felt that
the whole thing might not be a help becauise of the interest
rate increase, but what we're concerned about is that
Australians with entitlements: under the proposcals will.-know
what they are. and won't miss out because of inadequn-: te knowlee. ge W
DAY: 3Is it juist a Coincidence then that the ads re weighted toware~ s
Vi ctori a?
PRIME MINISTER:
Wll I don't really believe they are weighted towards Victoria,
but other people have made decisions about that, and they've
answered t~ hem.. but the I
DAY:
w~ hat will the ads be saying?
PRIHE bINISTER:
But wait a minute, can Igo on please for a minute because-
DAY; Sure. PRIM. E MINrSTER:
I think you would agree that it would be quite impossible for
a young couple to find out what their entitlement was if they.
read all the newspapers.
DAY: Yes. I admit to being confused myself. There a about
six or seven schemes.__
PRIM4E MINISTER:
And therefore, to have an advertisement that in short compass
gives an indication of what' s involved and how that young couple
can go in detail and find out whether they are entitled to
a new deposit aezistance, of two and a half to three and a half
thousand dollars, on settlement or for the purchase of a house
or a block of land, to find ouit if they are going to be. eligible
for the rebate, because they purchased their first home over the
last five years, or intend to purchase one shortly, to find out
if they & re going to be able to bo~ rrow., some of the additional
400-million dollars which the banks have said they will lend over
the next 12 nionths, to find out whet-her they will be eligible
for alow interest rate start for a new loart th-rough the banking
system, or whether they're el. igible for the shielding that the
banks are prepared to offer to certain, well to all. people, iwho
have ta1~ ai out a loan over the last two yea7, F. Now, all of that
is irnporltant-in-relation-to the entitlements of individual 1 .1
PRU'WMITNISTER: cont...
families, individual groups throughout the Austrzalianl communitY,
and I believe that we have an obligation to make sure that
people are: aware of their entitlements. if you want to,
you know, quite obviously, the whole housing package was
complex, it was an integrated package and -ijt involved very
substantial negotiations between the Treasurer and the
private banks, including the Coimonwealth Bank of course.
And therefore it's taken a long while to put together. We.
had said, the Treasurer said, and I said. thiat we'd be making
a statement when we're ready. We recognised the importance
of the problem, and the problem was in two parts. There was
a _ p~ otage of! -capital,. so enough loans weren' t being mnade
available, and important groups in the community, the price of
the loan, in other words the interest was too high. Buth we
said we'd make the statement when we were ready. If we'd
been looking for pure political advantage of our oWn, I suppose
y'ou might of expected that we would of announced something
before Lowe. But I knew we couldn't be ready before Lowe and
we weren' and we said so.
DAY: Yes but. in that grezater scheue of things, surely -10 days
wouldn't of made that much difference to people whio may or may
not be entitled and certainly it would of insulated you fr-QM_
any charges of blatantly assisting the Victorian Liberals, swit: h1
Federal money, taxpayers, money.
PR~ IME MTtj1STERYou'
re tall1Jin9 about the advertisements?
DAY: Yes. PRINFP 1MINrST1ER;
Well I was~ mostly talkilig about the policy. I believe and the
Treasurer took this Point this mornirt-g-hti-b nee
of making sure that people know what their entitlements are and
some of t. io~ e entitlements are imediate in terms of ma3 ing
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PRVIE MNIS'TER: Cont...
choices between the old home savings grant scheme and going
on to the new dieposit, assistance proposal, that we needed
to let people JRnow what the score is. Now
DAY:
But in so doing you're still coppifig criticism for uising.
taxpayers' money which may he seen to be helping theVictorian
Liberals. PRIKrE MIN.( STER;
I don't believe that the expenditure of a relatively small
cmoutit of money is going to alter the balance in the State of.
Victoria over issues that have, -in a sense, been fought ou t
over many months. I don't believe that for one moment.
DAY:
Are you worried that this, the tax rebate pack~ age, and the
homes package generally might be too limited. It affects only
PRI14F MMISTERYes,
hut s; omebody initerjected on me at Evans, Deakin a couple
of weeks ago and I said when did you take out your loani. And this
was before we announced anything. He sid 7 years ago. I said.
w'hat was the value of your house at that time. He said $ 16,000.
And obviously, lie's had very substantial. wage-increases zince,
and obviously his house Is worth v'erat, very much more than the.
$ 16 0O00 ho paid for it 7 years ago, And that particular person
would be p) aying a much smaller part of hifj weekly wage on the
home repayments-
DAY: I agree v; hth you. That if, entirely Valid until he comes to .9ell
and buy a new* house.
-8-
MME MINISTBR:
Well if he sells this house he will get the appreciated value f or
it, and he ha s already made the investment over time, you see. So
somebody whio has boughta-house earlier, sells that and buys another, V
if they had paid off the first house, they should have a major
p. Jof the equity for the one unless it is a substantially better house.
This interview with the Prime Minister was recorded a little
over an.-hour ago and sonte technical got into it then..
We were about 30 second away from a break, which we've just
taken, so we'll pick up the tape now.
that
There have~ been reports the economy is likely to get worse
before it gets better and this-has led to speculation that
you may call an early election. Will you?__
I still believe the Parliament will go its full-term. What
I have said, when Mr. 1eating indicated that he might want the
Labor Party to refuse Supply, what I have said is that in those
circumstances, quite plainly, the Liberal. Party bas got to be
ready, bec; ause if the Labor Party co) mbine with the Demnocrats
to refuse Supply, there will. obviously have to be an election.
DAY: i~. you have tr. uched on this before. H-ow do you see the
economic outlook% f orAutstralia.. in the next couple of years?
The wage : ncrea-ses, coupled with shorter 1hours have been very,
very unfortunatQ, because they've comte at a time when the rest
of the wo:' ld has been, beconing more comipetitive. There's
massve ueMployntu to neary 12 per. Dn-t in Britain aud
8 and 9 Per cent in a number of other countries. Wle know it's
too hig-here, but it's certainly riot as bad as in nios t o f the
OECD countiries. 1because of the level of
DAY:
it's abouL-double American though isn't it?. 9/
-9-
DAY: it's about double the Americah rate?
Here? DAY: Yes, P1RIMI MINI: STER:
No, theArerican rate is very much above ours.
DAY: What, infl~ ation? I'nm sorry, go on, uneimployment? F
PRIR4E MIN'_ STER:__
DAY: I'm sorry, I thoughit you were talking inflation.
PR7" 4L MP-U~ STER:
No, well) -their inflation rate is probably I suppose 8 or 9
per cent on an annual basis at the moment. B~ it it's been
coming down qiuite fast, But there' s no growth in the American.
economy. Round about the begiuning of the year, they were
prcoducing less than they had been. the year before, and that's
the position again. ln~ a nuxnber.-of European countries, so
under those circumrstances, it's not surprising they've been
getting wage settlements arounrd 6, or 8 per cent. And
againIst that background, they're becoming more competitive,
better able to 2ell theiir goods, and we're finding that our
prices are rising and it gets harder to sell Australian goods..
Nqow this obviously mal-es it difficult for Australiandl-rms
and difficult for Australian employment and we'% ve already begun
to see this reflected in the figures arnd so the first, if -you
like, challenge we have, probleim is the extent of the wages
increaseE;, the ireduced hours, the additional cost that meant
for indu : try n~ ing it Much harder to employ Australians.
PRIME 14INISTER: Cont...
The other thing that's iade it. dif ficult is the continued
downturn overseas and as a result of no growth, lower Inflation, I
and greater cornpatitiveness in overseas countries.
DAY; Just, butting in there if I may? How much do we depend on. theI
Reagan economnic experiment working?
PRIME MINISTER:
The American~ economy is so large. and so in many ways, that it
affects many, many coauntries, and-obviously it has an impact.
on Australia, and especially through interest rates at the
present time. So, we're significantly affected by what'
happens irt the United States. We're also very much affected
by what happens in Eur~ ope, That doesn't mean to say that
you know, we thirow up our hands in horror and say it's all too.
hard, They can mak~ e it difficult for us, ba. t.. we have..ñ obe
ready, prepared to adjust our owa policies to do the best
we possi. bly can to protect Australia in a difficult world
envi2ronment. Now up to the pxesent time we have, because
the econom~ y has grown, and expanded and household disposableincomes
have qro , m while the world income has' beent as flat as
it--ould' possibly be. The longer the world economy stays fl~ at?
the harder it will be to protect Autralia. But that's
our responsibility.
DAY: Yeah, in : xecent days, Sir Phillip Lyrich has foresbadowed the
possibilit~ y of a company tax reduction. Was-. he ju~ t--kite
flying or did he have your bac'kiig in that?
PRIME MINI) STER:
He really has you krnow. if you read the speech-
DA~ Y:
I I m sorry, I've onl. y read the press report.. W'hat did he say
then?
SPMRIMNI4SET rER:
As he put it in the Parliament this morning, he pointed to the!
fact that there are 1AC reports affectig the budgetary
assistance for industry, depreciation allowances export
incentiv~ es and investment allowances a a-nd whatever. And we've
asked th e XAC to report to us on all of these matters. We'll
have, there are two or three reports involved, we'l1' have themt
all fairly shortly, and then we'll be examining the reports.
Now the purpose of the examination in the first instance is not
to reduce support for industry, but to see whether the support
we are in fact providing has the most beneficial result for*
industry. Now, this as I understand it, is what Sir Phillip
was referring to,
DAY: 14m. All right. ] By the fact you've accepted this invitation
to talk to us today, you are, I-mean it's relatively rare, it's
not every day you get the Prime Minifster to talk to you.
Azrc-you stetting out to do a repair job on the Government's
image. Do youa see the Government in trouble at the moment?
H-ov~ long have you bec-n doing this programn?
Ohl almost three months.
PRIM~ E MNWSTIER:
Well, you know, I've been 5peaking to -on talkback programs
quite diriactly, qUite regUllarly I haven't been on your program
before, b-at I'm happyf to do it on a reasonably regular basis
if you'd like me to, because one of the advantager. of a talkhack
progr'am, you ask the questions and my words jo, out as the'y
coro. a. The y don't get edited, they kon't cjet chianged, they don't
get interpretted. At least. not at the time.
DAY: Some comm-antators have stiggested though that following Lotw-e, the
Goverament's imange, and your imgwell if I may Sayl it, low, and
I draw a ], iup, between those comments and your acceptance. We have
asked bofore anid you've been too busy, ; w ich I can also unders3tanld.
11
12
PRIME MINISTER
The acceptance hasn't. . n fact been put to me beforeand. maTer
it-should of
DAY: Perhaps it. should of,
PRINLE MINISTER:
1efore and after Lowe, I've been on talk-back programs with
Bert Newton and John LawS and other people in different States.
DAY: This is the thinking man's program. ( laughs)
PRIIKE MINISTER:
ell I'm very happy to be on the thinking man's program.
Aid so it may be just a function of the' fact that you have been operating
three months and not longer.
Are you going to miss David Barnett?
PRVV-14INISTER:
I will. He's been around a long time, but it's a veiry
tough-and rugged-job and I go to bed at night and the press
DAY: Have you got any one in mind to rep. ace him?
PRI4E MINISTER:
-gr. rgiiig him up all night.
DAY: ( laughs) Have you got any one in Tnnd to replac him?
Oell there are other people in the prez5 offic, and-at the
moment they will. be carrying on. .13/
13-
DAY:
All right, well one final question, and i do hesitate to raise
it, because of the stink that issue caused at the time of
CHOGM. But I've got my ear to the ground and I hear from
tine to tjme that you're not in the best of health, and
we don't report these tips from people allegedly in the no,
because thiey can't be confirmed, so simply, can I ask you
how is your health?
PRIMP, MINJISTER:
Fine. DAY: Fine. PRIRE MUISTER:
lim. DAY: it is a demanding job?
PRI( M E HINISTER.
Yes, of course it is.
DAY: But you looked to be enjoying yourEself at the Man from
Snowy River prelview at the weekend.
PRIME MINISTER:
It w) as a great film, it really was, and I think it will be
a wonderfuI f1 g carrier.
DAY: I saw it: last night, anld I agree % ith you. I don't agree with
you on everything Prime Minister, but I'll agree with you on that.
PRTME, MTNIS'ER;
You aqrrie with me oii t-he film, weli. that's a stai't, There inight
be hope for: you yt.
14
DAY: Oay, thank you very tnuch alid we' 1ll take you up on your
offer of more iegular interviews,
PRlIME ZINSTER:
Thank you. ENDS.