P. M.' s PRESS OFFICE CANB TEL: 61-062-732923 31,03,89 20: 22 No. 010 P. 01
PRIME-MINISTER
TIASCRIPT Of INTZRVIIW WITH NEREDITH CAXPDBLL, ABC RADIO
AL ALIC spNOS 3SPR
KI 0 PROOF ONLY
JOURNALIST: an overnighter in Alice Springs, one in
Darwin and a major commitment in between in atherine, now
time to go out and experience the rigours of the Olga. Road.
PM: Well I suppose I ought to do that now if I'S going to do
it because it's going to be the decison that I have announoed
to make all that money available to fix the road and it's not
going to be like that for much longer.
Journalist: And you say the construction may start before
the end of this financial year?
PNt I believe so, I hope so. we think v can do the
planning and the discussions with the community fairly
quickly and we certainly want to son it underway as quickly
as possible.
Journalist: Well it seemed yesterday morning on this program
the Northern Territory Minister for Tourism seemed to be
completely in the dark about the proposal.
PX: Well If you conduct yourself by uut getting up ad
making noises and not talking to people and finding out what
is happening locally you will find yourself in the dark, but
that is a pretty perpetual condition for our political
opponents federally as well as in this area.
Journalist: Considering that there will be a major
commitment, a contribut1on of funds to the project from the
Northern Territory Government don't you think that there
should have been a bit more communication at that point?
PN: Well. I don't think the decision will come In total
surprise to those that really need to know. And they will I
as sure make the relatively small contribution that we
are asking for so that there will be a total outlay of funds
of over $ 8 million which will see the road sealed and
upgraded and providing the sort of facility that the
Increasing demand of tourism is making upon us.
Journalist: Has Mr Pools contacted you to commend your
announcement?
i'M; Well I haven't had any message from him, I don't know
whether he has spoken, none of my people have maid they have
had contact from hiz.
Journalist: Given the timetable, does that mean there will
be tint to conduct negotiations or consultationsh with the
traditional owners of Uluru of the site location of the road.
PN: I believe so of this case. Yes.
Journalist! on~ to matters of defence, obviously your visit
to the Northern Territory in defence related and the Tindal
Air Base will represent a major resolution of this government
to direct defence energies to the defence of the north. In
Alice Springs an ongoing Issue remains the operations of the
Pine Cap Defence Bass here in Alice Springs which has a
strategic role in defence of the world, if you like, and last
night you were served with a subpoena to appear in Alice
Springs court in August on behalf of a gentleman called Mr
Lenin Limbo who was charged with tree pass at the major
demonstration at the Cap in 1907. Will you appear?
PM: I doubt it.
Journalist: Will you send a representative?
PX: Oh look I am not talking about that. I will hand over
the document to my advisers. I mean in the whole scheme of
things that very importanat things in this country, that will
rate if there are 16 pages of the agenda that will be
somewhere near the bottom of page 16.
Journalist: Not a serious move at all?.
PM:, well, I have answered the question haven't I?
Journalist.: Just a stunt?
IN: I an not concerned to haes a go at Xr LImbo, I an just
saying that if there are 16 age## detailed pages on my
agenda, if it a ppears it will be at the bottom of page 16.
mean there really are many, many more important things to
talk about and a relatively limited amount of time I would
have thqught.
Journalist: Yes indeed, and considering that Pine Cap should
be a source of pride to all Australians why is it the case
that negotiations to continue arrangementz for its presence
In Australia are they conducted in such secrecy?
PH. There has never been more openness about Pine Gap than
under my Government. I made now two major statements in the
Parliament about it, the people are better informed now than
they ever been before about the purposes and functions of
Pine Cap and the other joint facilities that we have in this
country. Just put very very simply it is Indisputably the
come that Australia and in this latter period Australia under
my Government had not had this cooperation# then we would not
an a world be able to Bay as we can with confidence now that
there in greater hope for a peaceful world in the future nov
than there over has been before, because these joint
facilities have ensured that the concept of mutual deterrence
has bean able to operate effectively, it has brought the two
super powers to the negotiating table an d the nonsense that
is put by some of the opponents that the fact of hoe i
these Joint facilities ade it difficult far Austral1 i o
play some part in these processes and nlegotiations
demonstrated by the fact that now over 12 months ago I was
able to be in the Soviet Union, personally had over three and
a half hours with Xr Gorbachev, talked in detail with him
about Issues of zest/ west cooperation of the processes that
are underway to bring about tNo elimination of total classes
of nuclear weapons and no one was able more than I was to
have that sort of lengthy discussion with Mr Gorbachev.
So it destroys the nonsense that is put by the opponents that
because we are host to theme joint facilities we are somehow
compromised and limited In our capacity to make a very
significant contrituion to the processes of peace. The very
opposite is the truth.
Journalist: Xr Hawke, let's get an to matters of domestic
relations. The compact or the treaty, the word is
unimportant, any idea of, the timetable of the commitment on
that? M~ When I was in Altie springs in 1967 when I first raised
the concept, I said then and my timing was quite intentionalag
we were coming into the Bicentennial. year, I maid that I
hoped that-it may be possible to complete these processes in
the lifetime of thie Parliament but I wasn't necessarily
wedded to that. And I don't think we will be able to
finalise it in the life of this Parliament and that
represents the fact that the Aboriginal people themsaelves
plus the Australian community as a whole, I think want a fair
bit of time to discuss these issues to see exactly what it is
that they want covered in such a treaty or compact or
whatever vs call it. go I think the more realistic
timetable, Meredith, in that we will see that completed in
the next Parliament but with very substantial progress being
made In the lifetime of this Parliament.
Journalist: Is the resolution of the corn act or treaty one
way to rid ourselves of the conflict, quilt and paranoiata
has existed about relations between Aborigines and
nora-Abor igines?
M3E Yes, I think so Meredith. I want to repast to your
listeners, and may I preface my commenht by saying how much I
have appreciated the way In which within the Northern
Territory there does seem to be now a much more mature
laapsptr oancighh to n anedv eyroyuo nesmaaw ptahretr. e waFsor ai npsrteatntcye pw idyeo u awreorsee tsheecrt* i on'
of th. Northern Territory community. And you saw the
reaction and 4s I walked around afterwards I net with a whole
range of people and there was no antagonism to the things J*
had been seeing. So I do pay tirbute to whit I think is an
increasingly mature and intelligent approach to this issue.
What I said last night is that there was no reason at all for
Australians to have some sense of collective national guilt
on this issue. That doesn't do anyone any lood. It is
rather a rational, cold rational understanding of the fact
that over the two hundred years of European settlement in
Australia there have been injustices no reasonable person
denies that, so it is simply acknowledging that and saying
well it is to the benefit of our Aboriginal brothers and
0 tshiastt erw* e adso n'wte lld waesl l twoi tthh e ab esneenfsiet ofo f guailllt ofo n ust h. i np aAsuts, tralia
recognise injustices and undertake to one another that we
are going to-work together for an Australia in which all.
people are going to be able to live together equally as
Australians. And let me make this pointg our political
opponents with a totality of opportunism and with an absence
of principle have characterised what I an talking about here
as creating two Australias. Nothing could be further from
the truth. What it is about in to make one Australia# and
one Australia stronger so that our Aboriginal oitias will
understand that we recognise the wrongs of the past and
accept a commitment to create an Australia in which
irrespective of background people are going to have * quality
of opportunity. on the part of the Aborigines themselvs
they are going to say well this is the case we understand
that this is the commitment of the whole of Australia. That
makes stronger Australia if we don't then be burdened with
various senes$ as you say of paranoia# guilt and so on. We
have faced up to the, issues, the indisputable fact that
injustices have been done. We are intelligent and mature
enough to say, yes, that is right, but we are going to do all+~
we can together to make sure that those injustices are
rectified and the quality of opportunity is created. Now
that is just a very sensible, adult and mature way of doing
things and creating a much more unified, united# strong,
single Australia.
Journalist: How has the experience of the Bicentennial
helped us shed our guilt and paranoia?
PM: I think to some extent, let me be precise about that.
There was an enormous amount of apprehension expressed you
will recall as we came up to the 26 January in ydney
when we were going to have the yreat celebrations there which
I think will remain in everyone s memory as one of theoutstanding
days oLthe century of our history as a nation.
Now people were saying the Aborigines were going to be there
and they were going to carry on, demonstrate, muck
everything up. Well nothing could have been further froathe
truth end it reflected enormous credit from the people that
stated rightly end understandably wanted people to know their
issues and their concern. They were there, but they
conducted themselves very responsibly-and I may I was spoken
to by representatives of the police and they couldn't have
been more fullsome In their praise of the responsible way in
which the Aboriginal people conducted themselves and I think
that that, right from the start of Bicentennial 1989 set a
good tone. In other words, perfectly legitimate to expect
the Aboriginal people to ask us to remember their position as
we remember two hundred years of European settlezent. And so
I think as the year went on it did have the result of making
us all, Aborigines and non-Aboriginesi understand the
importance of 1988, but understanding the importance of 1968
in the stream of 40,000 years of history.
Journalist: Mr Hawks, 2001 a Statehood Odyssey. Bob
Collins is keen on it, what is your view?
PM: Well, on the question of describing various ways, you
know statehood or whatever you went to describe it. I have
simply said there to your chief minister when he came to see
me about it a few weeks ago that this is something really
that we have got to see the people of the Northern Territory
the people, not just the politicians, but the people
indicating that this is really what they vent. And I doubt
very much whether at this stage that is the case. I-haven'tgot'
any evidence that overwhelmingly Northern Territorianswent
to assume rather not merely rights that can be seen as
involved in statehood, but obligations, And I must say quite
honestly that if I was Territorian I don't know that I would
be lumping up and down wanting statehood tomorrow. And 1
don t see any evidence of that. But if that position
develops and it can be demonstrated to us that that Is the
wishes of the people of the Northern Territory then we would
have to be beginning to look at it. You have to recognise ot
course that with the relatively small population of the
Northern Territory it would be very difficult to talk about
the equivalents of statehood in terms of numbers of Senators
In a Federal Parliament and so on. And lots of pratioal
difficulties but as I say I don't discern any popular clamour
for it. And if there is evidence brought before us that that
is something they want us to look at well then let's deal
with it at that point, I think that to some way down the
track though.
Journalist: Has Mr Perron communicated evidence of this
popular clamour?
M Not I think in fairness to the Chief Xinister he wasn't
asserting to an that that was the position.
Journlist: How does Mr Collins assort the position, sorry
Senator Collins assert the position to you?
PM: I think similarly that lob wouldn't be saying that this
is something that is on everyone's lips at the moment.
Journalist: Senator Collins, is ho In line for a ministry?
PM: Senator Collins would not be expecting that he would be
a candidate to fill the Luedlate Vacancy but I have had the
opportunity lust of'saying very recently that in terms of
both Bob Coll1ins and Warren Snowdon you have people with
outstanding capacity. They have made# I am not merely saying
this because I know they would like to hear it# but it Is
reinforced by the reaction I get when I come up here and see
the way in which right across the political spectrum the two
of then are so widely regarded and respected and and* an
enormous contribution not merely in terms of representing the
interest, of the Northern Territory, but when they speak in
the Caucus or in the Parliament they are listened to, So the
answer is that both Bob Collins anid Warren Snowdon at* of
ministerial timber. Their time will oomt, it is not
immediate, not in the terms ot this immediate vacancy, but
their time will come.
Journalist: Some recent events have indicated that the hard
edge of politics has been bruising you somewhat. Do you long
for a lees confrontational life?
PM Wall I don't regard politics as terribly
confrontational, I mean I think when the history books arol
written I think they will say that Hawke made a significant
contribution in trying to bring about consensus politics
rather than confrontationist politics.. I certainly hope that
is the case. I don't feel bruised at all by it, I " m
enjoying politics now more than I ever have because, in part
Meredith, after six years in office you have the great joy of
seeing what were originally concepts and ideas coming to
fruition. And that is enorsously stimulating and rewarding#
so I don't feel bruised. The only thing that one gets as
time goes on is the realisation that there really isn't any
privacy, any private life, you miss that somewhat but the
omlentationn are just so overwholmin! I so I an enjoying
poltict Iamenjoying the Prime Minls ership more than I
ever have.
Journalist; Will you lead the Parliamentary Labor Party
beyond the next election?
RESOFFICE CCR BNTB LTEL: 61-062-732923 31 0 , l . u
1K: Oh yes will lead then in to the next electiono I think
we wi141 win it and I will lead the Party through that next
term and then we will just let's see how things turn out
then. But I feel a vibrantly young end fit 59.
Journallist Row would a person who has led an often
controversial and flamboyant public life, plan to spend a
retirement?
P Well, perhaps less flamboyantly and less demandingly but
I can't imagine any period in ar life in which I won't be
active. There are a lot of things I want to do when that
time comes including, may I say, it to not-one of sharing the
lust of retired politicians to put pan to paper and write a
book. Now that could come at some time but Z don't have any
passion about that. I rather would like as I have said
before to have the opportunity of doing a series of
television interviews with people I have met around the world
* and in Australia who I think have influenced the world in
which they live. Influenced it for the better. I have had a
very unique opportunity now amongst Australians of being
exposed to these sort of people, I have been able to
establish close rapport and understanding with many of then.
I would love the opportunity of just sharing with millions of
people not only in Australia but around the world the
understandinq I have of these people and getting through the
opportunities at such Interviews, the capacity for ordinary
Australians and others to see the impact of individuals have
been able to have in shaping a better world, I regard that
as a very interesting project.
Journalist: Prime minister Hawke, your Oovernment's and
Australia's challenge for the
IX: Challenge for the 90m is oontinuing what we've been
doing and that is to try and make an Australia that is going
to be beet placed to take advantage of the challenges and
op : rtunities of the twenty first century. We're tryin to
mate an Australia which is a more competitive, eff/ oent
economy. That involves changes to education snd training, to
industrial structures. We're very well placed,
geographically and in terms of resources to make an enormous
contribution to and benefit from the dynamic growth of the
region of which we are part. But also to be an Australia
which is sure of itself, an Australia oomposed of people who
respect and love one another, because it is only on the basis
of respeot and love for one another that we are going to be
most efficient and most prosperous. I think we've gone a
long way down the path of achieving those goals, so it's not
a question, Meredith, of having new visions, setting new
goals, those visions end goals have been fixed for me and
before I became Prime Minister and throughout the Prime
Xinisterghip, what we can say at.. for the 90* now is through
the experience of these last six yearn, we know that those
goals are achievable. I think we ve learnt better how to
work towards them. I would love to see the 90s, this last
O
decade of this vibrant and dramatic twentieth century
conclude with us all knowing that we are better placed to
take advantage of the enormous opportunities of being where
we are in the world, as part of this regqion which Is growing
so fast, which is increasingly respected for our traditionsof
democracy, ot commitnent to the rights of individuals-and
taking our place as a leading menber of that region. Those
are the sorts of things that we have to do and, as I say, I
think we're better placed to do it now than we were six years
ago and basiceally that is because, aes Australians, we've
learnt to know one another better. We do have greater
confidence in one another, we are less of a confrontationist
society than we were atthe beginning of the 40s. Those are
the things we have to build on in the
Journalist: Prime Minister, thank you very much.
PX: It's been my pleasure Meredith, thank you very much.
ends