Prime Minister
BEN O'SHEA: The PM joins me now for the first time on The West Live. Good morning Prime Minister.
PRIME MINISTER: Well, g'day Ben, I'm pleased to be back, I've been looking forward to it. Importantly, I’ll be heading up north while I'm here to see first hand the devastation that has occurred as a result of Seroja, and this has been terrible and the Premier and I have been in contact over this now for these last few days in particular. And importantly I can tell people that at eight o'clock today Western Australian time, those people affected by that cyclone, will be able to get access to those $1,000 payments for adults and $400 per child. That was approved overnight, and so that is available from 8AM this morning on 1802266.
BEN O'SHEA: That's greatly appreciated, as I'm sure you'll see for yourself. It's like a war zone up there. The shire president said it's like a bomb has gone off. The devastation is just astonishing. Staggering, really. And they'll appreciate your visit. But does this mean that you're unofficially on the election trail, being back in WA?
PRIME MINISTER: Being in Western Australia is always been part of being Prime Minister. I mean, it's a big country and that's why I've been pleased to get back here. In 2019-20 were very difficult years. And in 2019, we were beginning to deal with bushfires back as late as September of 2019. I just returned from the United States, actually, and we're already dealing with those up in Queensland that Reynolds, you know, all the way through to the end of that year and into 2020. And then we were into the COVID-19 pandemic. And so where the Prime Minister needs to be when those things are occurring is at the helm. And that's where I was, in Canberra.
BEN O'SHEA: It has been an unprecedented two years. And now I mentioned that you haven't been here for 18 months. We had COVID in there, of course, but your absence during the WA state election was certainly noted by voters. The Liberal brand has been demolished here in WA. It's almost radioactive. How are you going to turn around the party faithful, some of whom voted Labor for the first time?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, we saw a similar result up in Queensland. I think what has occurred in COVID is there has been a great deal of consensus between premiers and prime ministers. I mean, the Premier McGowan and I have worked very closely on all the issues relating to COVID and the Federal Government has, of course, underwritten, financially, the Western Australian economy with the considerable supports we put in, whether it's on JobKeeper, the cash flow, both the COVID supplement payments, the pensioner payments that we paid. I mean, all of that directly equates to almost $14 billion dollars, directly into Western Australia. And then on top of that, there was keeping the flights connected, some 5,300 flights connected to Western Australia that was paid for by the Federal Government and some 51,000 tons of exports through our international freight program. So the Commonwealth Government worked well with the State Government and continues to. I'm looking forward to seeing the Premier this afternoon. There are many more issues for us to continue working on here in WA. So I think the leadership of the Premier here in Western Australia was recognised by the people of Western Australia, and I commend him for that. And we've both been working on that same plan.
BEN O'SHEA: Last time I spoke to Premier Mark McGowan, he said that you and he had a good personal relationship, but he said that that relationship got a little rocky when the Federal Government joined Clive Palmer's case against the West Australian's hard borders. You've been here for 12 hours now. Are you getting a sense of how deep the resentment towards Clive Palmer runs over here?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, we withdrew from the case and that came after the discussions I had with the Premier. I mean, the normal process for any Commonwealth Government where there's a constitutional case like that is they join a constitutional case. That's the expectation. In fact, the High Court was very upset with us when we pulled out of the case, but we pulled out of the case for the right reasons. The Premier and I talked that issue through, and I think we made the right decision. I mean, the Western Australian situation was very different to the rest of the country. And I've always had a keen understanding of that. I think I've always understood the Western Australian economy works quite differently to the rest of the country. And so the impacts of borders here were very different to what we're seeing on the eastern states. Very, very different. And so that's why I took a different approach here at Western Australia.
BEN O'SHEA: Do you think there's a challenge for you now to convince West Aussie voters of that? Because arguing constitutional law is always going to be one of those arcane sort of things that might fail to resonate with the electorate, whereas Labor just has to run a picture of you, Christian Porter and Clive Palmer, and it gets the message across very easily.
PRIME MINISTER: Well, that would be false if they did that because we withdrew from the case. Listened to the Premier, listened to Western Australians and took that action. That would just be a lie, if they did that.
BEN O'SHEA: They're been doing that, I've seen it in their advertising.
PRIME MINISTER: Well, that reflects on them. I think Western Australians know, particularly when it comes to what was, and still continues to be, one of the most significant issues that Western Australia has sought justice for, that was on the GST. As Treasurer, and as Prime Minister, I was the one that drafted the deal, worked the deal out, championed the deal as an eastern states Prime Minister, that there was no one more passionate than me about righting the wrong over the GST for Western Australia than me. You could have a bet each way on that like the Labor Party had. And like Anthony Albanese always has on everything. There's no two bets either way with me when it came to the GST and WA, so the only person that you can trust to make sure that deal sticks is the person who made it and the person who championed it. And that was me.
BEN O'SHEA: And it was about the GST was a massive issue for us here in Western Australia. And you certainly helped us out with that. Has it hurt you in other states, though?
PRIME MINISTER: No, because it was the right thing to do. I mean, there was a real problem. And I acknowledge that there was a real problem, as Treasurer, and set about fixing it. And that has meant I had to take the whole country there, I had to get legislation through a very difficult Senate and Parliament, and that took quite a lot of commitment. And if I was not committed to that, it would never have happened. And that's what it needed. And that's why Western Australians can trust me to keep the deal that I made. And I'll be telling the Premier that again today. That deal sticks with me. I am its greatest advocate and its greatest champion.
BEN O'SHEA: Well, let's change tack. Former Australia Post Chief Executive Christine Holgate has asked you for an apology. Are you sorry?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, that day in Parliament was quite a heated day. The Labor Party was calling for her resignation, I recall, and Parliament can get pretty willing. And I gave a very strong response. I mean, the suggestion was that the Government somehow endorsed the use of taxpayers' funds in a Government owned company to hand out Cartier watches to people who already got paid very well and already had performance bonus arrangements as part of their existing salaries. Now, that was not something I agreed with. Now, you know, my language on that day was very strong. It was back in October. And I see that that has caused some very, very strong reactions from Christine. And it hurt her deeply. And that was not my intention. And so I regret that. But at the same time, the issue here was how taxpayers' funds were being used in a Government owned company. And as Prime Minister, I have to stand up for those standards, and did. That's what ultimately this issue was about. I mean, it was not an intention for me to upset or offend Ms Holgate. And I appreciate that she has gone through a difficult time. And that's not something that I would like to have seen happen. But the issues when you're in public life and whether it's running a large organisation like Australia Post or indeed the Prime Minister, we're all accountable for the decisions we make and the things that we do. And there is accountability around that. And that's how this issue began. It was about Cartier watches being handed out to well-paid executives for doing their jobs. And that was not something that my Government supported.
BEN O'SHEA: You mentioned the hurt that she felt, she said she was treated differently because she was a woman. Given what we've seen in Canberra these past two months, could she be right about that?
PRIME MINISTER: No, I don't accept that. I mean, that is no more true that Cartier watches were handed out because of their gender or than the rules that would apply in relation to that. This was about the issues of taxpayers' money. And no I don't accept that there are any gender related issues here at all. This was about that issue. Now my language was strong. Parliament can get very heated, as I said the Labor Party were calling for her resignation. What I said, on that day, was that there should be an enquiry, which there was, and it actually confirmed these and a number of other matters. And I said that the CEO should stand aside while they are doing that. And if she did not choose to do that, then she would take that other course. She ultimately decided to resign. Now, that was a choice for her at that time. And those matters are being dealt with between the board of Australia Post and Ms Holgate. They don't involve the Prime Minister or the Government.
BEN O'SHEA: And do you feel you were adequately briefed on the issue before speaking in Parliament about it?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, the independent report confirmed what happened with the watches, confirmed a number of other issues as well, which were also troubling. And it was very clear that the statement had been made that this was not taxpayers' money. And I took great deference with that statement, considerable deference with that statement. If you're running a government owned business, then it is taxpayers' money and has to be treated like that.
BEN O'SHEA: And now you're going to visit the mid-west of WA to see the areas affected by Cyclone Seroja. A little bit north is the heart of the WA resource sector, really the heart of the Australian economy. You said the idea of mining companies vaccinating workers is an interesting one. The bigger problem, of course, is the nationwide rollout. National Cabinet is going to be moving back to a war footing to address this.
PRIME MINISTER: Well, that's right. I mean, we've got some challenges to deal with. The first challenge we had was the three million doses from overseas didn't turn up because of the problems that were being experienced in Europe. And those circumstances are beyond the Government's control. We started the programme when we said we'd start it, but its initial rates were lower because of the lack of the supply of those vaccines. Now, we're getting on top of that and we've got up to the point of around about 80,000 vaccinations a day. The majority of those have been through the GPs. And then we got the advice from ATAGI, which is the advisory group to the Minister on medicines and on these vaccines, which raise some very remote risks in relation to the AstraZeneca vaccine. Now, that has had, and we expect we'll continue to have, an impact on the take up and the rollout of the vaccine, that's what we have to address. It is a safe and recommended vaccine for people aged over 50, and the AstraZeneca vaccine continues to be manufactured in Victoria and being rolled out and distributed right across the country. And it's important that we get people aged over 50, particularly those aged over 70, which is the target group right now, vaccinated, because they are the most vulnerable population, particularly as we go into winter. The vaccine protects people from serious illness. That's its first job. And for those most vulnerable. If there were an outbreak whether here in Perth or Melbourne or Sydney or anywhere else, and that went through the community, and the people who are elderly are the most at risk. We saw that in Victoria when there was the break out there. Now, to prevent or to mitigate the risk of that, we need to get our older population vaccinated. And that can be done safely with the AstraZeneca vaccine. As we move into the second half of this year, when we were planning to move into the balance of the population, those between 50 and 70 and those of younger ages as well, then those, particularly under 50, will have the preference upon the medical advice for the Pfizer vaccine and indeed the Novavax vaccine. Now, the Pfizer vaccine deliveries will increase in the weeks and months ahead, but we're able to quickly secure a further 20 million doses of Pfizer. We're not expecting that until quarter four of this year and we're not expecting the Novavax vaccines until quarter four this year as well. So that will mean we'll need to change our rollout to go to mass vaccination options, and that will have to be done in partnership with the states and territories. Now, if we can do all that then there is the possibility that can be achieved by the end of 2021. But at this stage, there are too many uncertainties. I think to commit to a timetable like that, I would need, and states would need to be sure, that they could put those arrangements in place and ramp them up and to do that safely with the population to achieve that. So there's a lot of work to do together. The rollout has to change because of events of the AstraZeneca vaccine issues that have been highlighted. Yes, they're rare, but we have to follow that medical advice for people's safety. And that means we have to now change the rollout, because of that. But the earlier phases we're dealing with right now are those over 70 that can be done with the AstraZeneca vaccine. And we're pushing ahead with that. And by mid this year, we hope to be through those vulnerable population priorities. And that's what we're very focused on delivering right now.
BEN O'SHEA: I know a timeline is almost impossible given all of the uncertainty, but if you had to decide as sort of an ideal percentage of the population that would be vaccinated by the time we go to the polls, the next Federal election, would be 50 per cent, 75 per cent. What is the likely number?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, we're taking advice from the medical experts on that at the moment. So I don't intend to get ahead of that advice and they are assessing the various scenarios and what sort of level of protection that provides. I mean, you raise a good point, but I mean, the issues have been raised about opening up international borders. It is still a very dangerous world when it comes to COVID right now. And that's not looking like changing anytime soon. And we have to understand that even with the vaccinated population that, you know, if we can vaccinate our most vulnerable, the elderly and those with disabilities, those on our front line and the health system and in roles like that, then we are protecting ourselves from the worst outcomes of COVID. And if we want to treat COVID like the flu, then we have to have the same tolerance for COVID as we have for the flu. And people get the flu and there would be cases of COVID if the international borders were lifted, there would be cases and we'd have to be confident and comfortable that that would be in Australia's interest to have, in potentially large numbers of cases of COVID, knowing that it would not lead to the horrific outcomes that we saw, in particular in Victoria, when the second wave ripped through particularly Melbourne. And so they are real legitimate questions that need to be worked through with states and territories. There's a lot of focus on the daily number of cases, both by state governments, their chief health officers and their premiers, but also by the media. And so we would need to be, I think, of one mind that if we were to go to those steps later in the year or soon after, then they would have to be an appreciation that would come with case numbers for COVID in Australia. And we would have to be understanding of what that meant. And the goal right now is to make sure our most vulnerable are protected from any possible outbreaks, because we never have 100 per cent certainty against that.
BEN O'SHEA: Is a successful vaccination rollout important to your Government's re-election?
PRIME MINISTER: It's important to Australia, and that's why, and that's why I'm focused on it.
BEN O'SHEA: Well, now we know your footy code of choice is rugby league. I'm a Queenslander myself, so I get that. But you’ll be at Optus on Friday night for the footy, West Coast taking on the Pies. Will we see you in blue and gold or black and white?
PRIME MINISTER: Well, I remember being at the G for the grand final when West Coast won. It was a very exciting game. And it seemed to be quite prophetic, too, for another contest the next year with that kick right from the boundary line. It was quite a remarkable game. So that has always meant I have a soft spot there. As you know, I don't follow any particular AFL team. I think that would be pretty disingenuous. I think people sort of sniff that stuff out. And I have my Sharks and I love my Sharks and I enjoy going. But I always enjoy going. You know what's amazing about it? So many countries in the world right now can't do that. Yes, we've got our challenges, but we are living life here in Australia and particularly here in Western Australia. And I give credit to the West Australian Government. We've worked together to achieve that result here in Western Australia, that we're living here in a way that so many others around the world are not. And while we have our challenges. I think at the same time, it's always important to have that perspective. And on Friday night, I think I'm hoping to be there with Mathias Cormann, the new Secretary-General of the OECD. He will do a fantastic job. A great Western Australian and it will be our first opportunity to really catch up since we're able to secure that result for Australia. And Mathias I think will be a great, great person in that role, drawing on both his values as a Western Australian and particularly as Australia's longest serving Finance Minister. And I'm very pleased that he's been appointed to that role.
BEN O'SHEA: Well, given where the rest of the world is with the pandemic, it'll be quite a special moment, I'm sure it'll be at Optus stadium, nearly full house. I hope you enjoy one of our Gage Roads beers while you're there. Prime Minister Scott Morrison, thanks for your time this morning. I know you've got a lot of ground to cover while you're in WA. I'm sure West Aussies will be happy to see you in their patch.
PRIME MINISTER: Great to be back. Cheers Ben.