NEIL MITCHELL:
Good morning day two of what is probably a 15 week election campaign. Now it’s daunting for us. Not for politicians they enjoy it. It’s a crucial one. This election must return stability and direction in Australia. We cannot return to the frantic nature of the past nine years. Six Prime Ministers in nine years. Your calls in a moment. On the phone from his Sydney office, the Prime Minister, Mr Turnbull. Good morning.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning Neil.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Thank you for your time. Three of the crossbenchers say they‘ll oppose the bill, they say publically, so the July 2 election seems inevitable. Let’s cut through the politics. What do you think really matters to Australians in this election? What are the key issues?
PRIME MINISTER:
The big issue is who do you best believe is going to be able to manage, continue to manage, our successful transition of our economy from one that has been fuelled by a mining construction boom as you know at the peak, investment in mining and related construction was up to 8 per cent of GDP so it was a massive hike. That has obviously come off significantly, in terms; you know commodity prices have come down. All of this was inevitable Neil. But what do we do, what’s next? And what’s next is a more diverse economy one that is driven by innovation, by greater productivity, by open markets, by more investment, by more entrepreneurship. That’s what we’re delivering. Every element of our economic plan is focused on delivering that and the outcome is better jobs, more of them, for our kids and grandkids and ourselves too of course.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Bill Shorten says ‘jobs and taxes’. Do you agree with that?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well jobs yes. But who is best able to deliver better jobs is absolutely the answer. I am glad Mr Shorten has identified that. But I have to say that his policies are absolutely calculated to undermine employment in Australia.
NEIL MITCHELL:
So how much is taxation a part of the campaign?
PRIME MINISTER:
Taxation will be a big part of it I’m sure. Again Labor has chosen to go out early with a policy on negative gearing that will lower house prices, reduce investment in the housing sector, increase rents, reduce housing affordability, reduce the number of houses and flats that are available for people to rent, it’s extraordinary policy and of course in addition to that, this is really, in some ways this is the worst, saddest part of what they proposed, don’t we all agree that we need more investment? Of course we do. Why then would you be putting up the tax on capital gains by 50 per cent?
NEIL MITCHELL:
So what do you promise on tax?
PRIME MINISTER:
We will deliver a tax package, a tax plan, in the budget which will be on the 3rd of May as you know which will be, every element of which will be devoted to driving and supporting stronger growth, more employment, and so forth.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Will you give us any broad brush on your tax policy? Will there be a reduction in taxation, an overall reduction in the tax take?
PRIME MINISTER:
What I will do is deliver it all on the 3rd of May Neil. I understand the interest and curiosity in it.
NEIL MITCHELL:
No, no, to be fair. You’ve just spent a couple of minutes kicking Bill Shorten for his and it’s reasonable to say well what’s yours?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well it is reasonable for you to say that. It’s also reasonable for me to say that as consistent with tradition it will be contained in the budget which is on the 3rd of May. I mean Mr Shorten, look, when I was Leader of the Opposition I waited for the Government’s budget and then I produced some alternative tax proposals two days later on the Thursday night. Mr Shorten has chosen to go out early. He has put up his wares early. That’s fine. He has done that presumably to evoke some sort of reaction and he has got it. People are increasingly horrified that you’d have such a set of policies that are so likely to restrain growth.
NEIL MITCHELL:
So your full tax policy will be in the budget? You won’t have something in the budget and then announce a policy before the election?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, all of the tax changes will be in the budget, yes that’s right.
NEIL MITCHELL:
So once we see the budget we know your tax policy?
PRIME MINISTER:
Yeah sure. Well that’s right. I mean obviously if we get re-elected, the budget, you know future budgets will, tax laws, tax policies change over time.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Yeah but do you to go to election with more – here’s the budget and now before the election we’re also going to do this in the next three years?
PRIME MINISTER:
We will be setting out our tax policy, our tax changes, in the budget Neil and that will be a comprehensive statement.
NEIL MITCHELL:
I suppose by definition you have been critical of Tony Abbott’s Government but I want to play you what he had to say today and get your reaction. The former Prime Minister -
TONY ABBOTT [Extract]:
The Turnbull Government is seeking election fundamentally on the record of the Abbott Government; stopping the boats, finalising the free trade agreements, our strong national security policy. It’s very easy for me to campaign for the election of the Turnbull Government because the Turnbull Government is running on the Abbott Government’s record, and it’s a very strong record.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Your reaction? Do you agree? Are you standing on the record of his Government?
PRIME MINISTER:
As I said earlier today there is continuity and there is change. I give full credit to Tony Abbott for his success for example in stopping the boats. Mind you, you know continuity and change, Tony’s Government which I was a member, our policy on stopping the people smugglers was to re-instate the policy of the Howard Government of which we were both Cabinet Ministers. When I was Opposition Leader before Tony became leader I strongly opposed Rudd’s dismantling of the Howard policy. So whether it is Howard as Leader of the Liberal Party, Abbott or Turnbull, we’ve had the same policy on border protection. So this is not something that was invented by Tony Abbott, this has been a continuum and we will maintain the same policy commitment.
NEIL MITCHELL:
But if the record of his Government was good, presumably you wouldn’t have felt a need to replace him? So how can he then say you’re campaigning on it?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I’m campaigning on economic management and there are a number, as I said, there is continuity and there is change. There are many policies now it’s increasingly policies that are ones that are signatures of my leadership. For example the whole innovation strategy, providing incentives for people to invest in startup companies. Providing incentives to ensure that researchers collaborate with business. Researchers in the universities collaborate with business. Changing the corporate bankruptcy laws so that there is greater emphasis on business continuity so that banks can’t shut down companies that get into financial difficulties immediately. Media ownership laws, Neil, of interest to the owners of your radio station.
Tony did not want to do anything about that. I’m taking, I’ve taken that thorny issue out of the long grass and we’re dealing with it. Senate reform, that wasn’t a feature, that is now done, the law has been changed. So there are a lot of things I’ve done that are either he hadn’t done or that he wasn’t of a mind to do, but broadly speaking there is therefore strong continuity but also change as you get with any Prime Minister.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Do you want him to play a national role on the campaign?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well Tony is a national figure and I hope that he will be supportive and he is indicating that he will be and that will be good.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Do you think he’s a plus or minus for you?
PRIME MINISTER:
Oh, look, I’ll leave that for others to comment. It depends what he says, frankly. Whether it’s a plus or a minus depends entirely on the nature of his contribution.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Are you going to have a word to him about that because he does seem a little bit dangerous a little bit of a loose cannon for you.
PRIME MINISTER:
I can see the line of country you’re drawing me into and I’m going to decline the invitation.
NEIL MITCHELL:
I think that’s an answer! With respect, the things you outlined a moment ago, they’re fairly theoretical, I mean, do the public really relate to them? What about health?
PRIME MINISTER:
What is theoretical…?
NEIL MITCHELL:
Oh, I don’t think the public cares too much about media ownership and you talk about innovation and things to the future.
PRIME MINISTER:
I’ve got to tell you, I think the public do care about innovation. I think everywhere I go people are talking about it because they recognise --
NEIL MITCHELL:
Really?
PRIME MINISTER:
That if we don’t do things differently. If we’re not more innovative, if our kids don’t have the skills for the digital 21st Century then we’re not going to be successful. I agree with you, look, media ownership laws are most important, the most important thing we’ve done with the media ownership law changes is that once those changes are adopted it will ensure and it will, if you like, in a belt and braces way, ensure that there will be strong local news content in regional Australia and in fact more than there is today now that probably doesn’t mean a lot to people in Melbourne, I guess they wouldn’t notice. But if you are in regional Victoria or regional anywhere in Australia those changes are very important and they are ones that I have led and made sure happen.
NEIL MITCHELL:
People talk to me about health. What can you offer the health system?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, health is what is the probably the biggest topic of conversation at the COAG meeting which will be on the 31st of this month and the 1st of next month and I’ll have more to say about that very shortly.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Penalty rates, they talk about penalty rates, what will you do on penalty rates?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, penalty rates are being dealt with by Fair Work as you know, so that’s --
NEIL MITCHELL:
Do you have a policy on penalty rates?
PRIME MINISTER:
Our policy is that they should be set and determined by Fair Work Australia.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Company tax cuts?
PRIME MINISTER:
Anything to do with tax is going to be dealt with in the budget and you’ll have to wait until then. It’s not long to wait.
NEIL MITCHELL:
No, no, fair enough. Superannuation?
PRIME MINISTER:
Again, it’s all being considered and dealt with in the budget.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Can we say whether it will be changed or not? Because there is nervousness about it.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I don’t want to be seen to be difficult, Neil but I think that it is better that, again, I take, I am a somewhat, I am a different Prime Minister to some of my predecessors. I believe that government should look at these issues very carefully, take all of the issues, matters into account, confer confidentially in the Cabinet, and then, when we make a decision, announce it. Rather than providing hints and leaks and briefs and front running. I know that isn’t much good for the media but I prefer to make decisions and then announce them, just as I did yesterday.
And so, with tax, you will see it all in the budget.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Fair enough. You’re standing has taken a battering in the polls, why?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, that’s really a matter for pundits like yourself, or great analysts like yourself to determine. I’m not going to run a commentary on myself.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Fair enough, did it hurt, though?
PRIME MINISTER:
Honestly, I’ve been in this business for long enough to be untroubled.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Well, you know very well, the analysis is that you have been seen as dithering, as indecisive, have you been?
PRIME MINISTER:
That didn’t seem to be the analysis of yesterday’s announcement.
NEIL MITCHELL:
No, no, but that is what, six and a half months into the job?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, Neil, I just say this to you. We have announced and done a great deal. The Innovation Agenda was a series of very important measures. The Defence White Paper, this is setting up Australia’s security for the 21st-century. Massive investments in Australian industry and innovation, technology and jobs. We got the China Australia Free Trade Agreement approved through the Parliament.
Do you remember, the Labor Party, they don’t like to remember it now, but the Labor Party were vehemently opposed to that. We secured the Transpacific Partnership deal. You know, we have a new Cities policy which is focused on getting real outcomes for liveable cities from Commonwealth investment, not just focused on giving money for roads but focused on, right across the board, and, you will hear more about that. It is very important, from an infrastructure point of view.
NEIL MITCHELL:
When you took over, you created a level of expectation, you talked about an economic vision. When do we get it?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, the economic vision is the one I talk about everyday which is that we, in order to ensure that we can maintain a high wage, generous social welfare net, first world economy and have great opportunities for our kids and grandkids, take advantage of the most exciting times in human history, we have to be more innovative, more productive, more competitive. And, there are a whole range of things we have to do to achieve that.
See, I think one of the mistakes or misapprehensions that is out there is imagining that there is one silver bullet. One particular policy measure that like a shot of adrenaline will suddenly transform things. It's a whole range of things, you know, changing the competition laws, changing section 46. Again, that is something that is been done under my leadership that wasn't done under my predecessor’s or, any of his predecessors' for that matter.
This is a change that will ensure that small and medium business are on a level playing field, a much more level playing field, with big business. Now, that of course is of enormous advantage to the economy.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Okay. Changes to pensions on the table?
PRIME MINISTER:
I'm not going to canvass the contents of the budget.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Oh, that's budget as well?
PRIME MINISTER:
It is, well, of course it’s budget, you know it's budget.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Well, if it wasn't on the table, it wouldn't be in the budget.
PRIME MINISTER:
Oh, come on Neil, don't play games. Let's leave the budget until the 3rd of May and then we'll, and then all will be revealed. It is not long to wait.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Another thing you promised was no slogans. Will there be no slogans in this election campaign?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I'm generally criticised for talking at too much length, so I think, I think quite a few of my critics would prefer if there was a little bit, if just a few slogans would sneak in, rather than the lengthy explanations, yeah.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Is there any hope, Prime Minister, that you can get these bills through and they will not be an election on the 2nd of July?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, Neil, I'm glad you’ve asked that because I don't, I think there is. I think, they are, we need six of the, look, Labor and the Greens are never get support the return of the Australian Building Construction Commission.
NEIL MITCHELL:
You need six of the eight, but three have said they won't do it so you look defeated already.
PRIME MINISTER:
Yeah, but, they can change their mind. You know, I mean people, and it is, the Senate crossbench has been a bit mercurial at times, changeable. And so I don't think you'll know whether they will vote for this until the vote is called on, frankly.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Do you want an election on the 2nd of July or later? Which would you prefer?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I want the bills passed. The only reason you would have a, the only reason to have a double dissolution election is to resolve a deadlock between the House and the Senate.
If those bills, if the Australian Building and Construction Commission Bills are passed and the rule of law is returned to the construction sector, you see, in Melbourne you guys have got better experience of, more experienced than anyone of why that is necessary.
And, if the Registered Organisation Bills are passed which are basically ensure that unions and employer organisations have to be accountable, transparent, no more secret commissions like we saw with the AWU and Clean Event.
If those bills are passed, then, there is no trigger for a double dissolution and we will have an election in the usual time, in September probably.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Just a Clean Event reference, is Bill Shorten's union past a target in this? In your campaign?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I think Bill Shorten's union past is an issue. I don't want to play personality politics but I just say this. Bill ran the AWU for a long time. The AWU's practices were very heavily, were exposed and very heavily criticised in the Royal Commission.
There is plainly something wrong with the way the unions have been governed. I mean, there has been far too much unaccountability, far too much corruption, far too much lack of transparency.
NEIL MITCHELL:
But, you are not saying Bill Shorten is corrupt?
PRIME MINISTER:
No, no, of course I'm not. I am not saying any. I'm not talking about Bill Shorten, Neil. I'm just saying that Bill Shorten knows that there is something rotten in the state of Denmark. There is something rotten in the unions. And he, everybody knows that. And yet, he seems to want to turn a blind eye to it. And, the problem is, nobody else is turning a blind eye to it.
Now, if I was, look, the Labor Party and the unions are not going to take advice from me. But, I say to you honestly, if I was a union leader and if I had the best interests of the union movement at heart, I would be supporting these laws because better regulation, stronger compliance with the law will give people more confidence in the unions and people will be more likely to join them.
What these guys don't seem to recognise is that every year, union membership declines. Now, if you have got a business and every year your revenues are going down, something is going wrong. What's happening with the unions is people have less and less confidence in them because of the CFMEU's outrageous lawlessness, because of Kathy Jackson, because of Craig Thomson, because of the Clean Event.
I mean, fancy a situation where the AWU traded away workers' rights, including penalty rates, including penalty rates, traded them away in industrial agreement, and then, without telling their members, took $25,000 a year as a payment from the employer back to the union. I mean, that is clearly wrong. But, they don't seem to accept, Mr Shorten doesn't seem to accept that there is anything wrong with that.
Now, in the corporate world, that would be completely unlawful. So, what we are seeking to do with the Registered Organisation's law and ABCC is, as much as anything, to protect the members of unions.
So, this is not anti-union, this is pro member of union. I mean, it is, and it also, with the ABCC, I might add, Neil, part of that is beefing up that Federal Construction Code so that contractors who do the wrong thing will not be able to get Federal work. So again, that's another way we use our influence to ensure that, whether it is at the contract level, the bosses' level or the workers' level, the law is being complied with and everyone benefits.
NEIL MITCHELL:
Prime Minister, thanks for your time.
PRIME MINISTER:
Thanks so much, Neil.
Ends