E&OE..................................................................................................
SATTLER:
Good morning Prime Minister.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning Howard.
SATTLER:
I thought I might try and scene set a bit. Did I get it right?
PRIME MINISTER:
Oh largely but I think the thing you didn't acknowledge is that the
deal between the Democrats and the Government delivers 85 to 90 per
cent of what the public endorsed last October.
SATTLER:
But it is not the tax package on which we voted your party into office
is it?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, it's 85 to 90 per cent. And the only alternative would have
been for us to say to the Australian public, because we didn't get
the 100 per cent we wanted we are going to ask you to have yet another
election. Now, can I tell you the mail I was getting from the Australian
public was that it didn't want another election on this issue. That
most people I spoke to before and certainly everyone I have spoken
to since, without exception, no one exception, and I'd have spoken
to hundreds of people since and they've all said, we think you
are very sensible to reach an agreement with the Australian Democrats.
SATTLER:
Were they people within your own party?
PRIME MINISTER:
No, there were people outside it. Loads and loads of people outside
my own party. Howard, one of the things you have got to remember is
that when people elect people as Prime Minister or Premier or whatever,
or party leaders, they do expect them by and large to solve their
differences. I would think in the long-term that public esteem for
the Leader of the Australian Democrats has gone up as a result of
this agreement. Whereas public esteem for the Leader of the Opposition,
Mr Beazley, has gone down because he just huffs and puffs and says
"no". He never tries to engage us in any kind of debate.
He took no notice of the result of the last election. I mean, even
if you accept his theory about split mandates you don't do it in the
knowledge that we were returned. I mean, he's still in Opposition
and I am still Prime Minister.
SATTLER:
Yeah, but I wonder how the esteems of both of you would sit, and with
the Democrats, now with people like small retailers who have got this,
sort of, mish-mash and anomalies and all that sort of thing to contend
with.
PRIME MINISTER:
Howard, not everything in this package is acceptable to everybody.
I understand that, but nobody gets everything. And we argued uphill
and down dale. We put our political bodies on the line and we won
the election. We couldn't get it through the Senate because the opposition
parties in the Senate would not agree to the plan that we put to the
electorate. And I sat down with Senator Lees and I negotiated and
I found that I could reach agreement with her on 85 to 90 per cent
of our plan. And I thought accepting it on that basis was infinitely
better than the two alternatives.
SATTLER:
Now, you mention 85 to 90 per cent. I have been running a web poll
for the last few days and 87 per cent say they want to have another
election on it, they'd like to have a vote on it.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I am not for a moment casting aspersions on your web poll, certainly
not. But that is not the mail I am getting in my discussions with
people all over the country.
SATTLER:
What about the Premiers? I mean, Richard Court started it and others
have picked it up and they are saying that this is not the package
on which they signed off. So what is the paper on which they signed
off worth now?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, obviously there have been some changes but all of the additional
costs, and I say this very carefully, all of the additional cost as
a result of the agreement I made with the Democrats is being borne
by the Commonwealth. That's $1.4 billion in the year 2000/2001. That
is being borne by us. Now, nobody has got everything they wanted.
That is always the case with a compromise. But there comes a point
in public life where you have got to ask yourself whether the compromise
is better than the alternatives. And I came to the conclusion that
it was. Now, I don't like it but I am a realist. And I ask the Premiers
to be realistic about it. They will still be better off. We will still
be abolishing, albeit at a slower rate, most of the unsatisfactory
taxes they have at a State level. There will still be a guarantee
that they will be not a dollar worse off during the transitional period.
We will still be giving them full access to the GST revenue which
will over time provide them with more resources to fund government
schools and hospitals and police.
SATTLER:
So there agreement still stands does it? 87 per cent of it does or....
PRIME MINISTER:
The fundamental elements of the agreement with the States, of course
it still stands. The changes relate to the need because of the reduced
quantum of the GST revenue because basic food has been taken out there
will be a delay in the removal of some of the States' indirect
taxes. But their financial position will still over time be much better
than it would have been if they had continued under the existing Commonwealth/State
financial arrangement. And during the transition period the guarantee
that we have given to the States will remain intact, in full. And
we are carrying on our account, we are carrying the additional cost
of the compensation that's been injected into the taxation plan. We
are not asking the States to carry that.
SATTLER:
Prime Minister, would you agree it got a bit farcical this week with
senior Ministers and your opponents arguing over cooked whole and
parts of chicken, frozen peas, packaged salads, cakes, plain and cheese-topped
bread and even soup? I mean, it almost looked like your worst nightmare
was being realised.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, can I say to you, Howard, I think that is ridiculous. But that
line of attack was initiated by the Labor Party, by the Opposition.
I mean,...can I just say to Mr Beazley, waving a can of soup around
in front of a camera is not a tax policy. If the Labor Party had had
a serious well thought out alternative to what we have put forward
then the public would take them more seriously. The Australian Democrats
have demonstrated a commitment to the national interest by sitting
down with the Government and working out a compromise. Now, this plan
will deliver great economic benefits to Australia. 80 per cent of
Australian taxpayers will be on a top marginal rate of 30 cents in
the dollar. We will be reducing business costs by about $10.5 billion
a year. We will be taking down the cost of diesel. There's a huge
benefit for wheat growers in a State like Western Australia because
one of the new elements of the package is that diesel excise on rail
carriage has been totally removed. Now, that's an enormous benefit
to the wheat growers of Western Australia.
SATTLER:
Sure, but for an outlet like, say, KFC, I know they're a big multinational
to come out and say that 24,000 jobs are at risk because there are
anomalies in whether or not a whole or a part of a chicken is going
to attract a GST. I mean, surely that's an anomaly that should be
cleaned up.
PRIME MINISTER:
Howard, nobody is totally satisfied about everything, that is the
nature of a compromise.
SATTLER:
But we are talking jobs here....
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I am talking jobs too and the net economic benefit of this package
will be to add jobs in Australia not subtract them. I don't believe
that that claim is properly based. I believe it is an exaggeration
and....
SATTLER:
...don't agree with the example of the whole or part chicken, one
part attracting a GST one not?
PRIME MINISTER:
Now, look, I have made a compromise deal with the Australian Democrats
and what I am saying is that if we are so immature as a community
and as a group of people to focus all of our debate on the periphery
rather than the heart and soul and the centre of this package and
the enormous benefits that it delivers. I mean, I could spend the
next half an hour regaling you with examples of anomalies in the wholesale
tax system, about the difference between the taxation of toothpaste
and a toothbrush, the differential treatment of chocolate biscuits.
And I could go on for half an hour...
SATTLER:
But that is why most people voted, or they voted...
PRIME MINISTER:
And there are still far fewer anomalies, far, far fewer. I mean, to
start with, we have one rate. Under the wholesale sales tax there
were five.
SATTLER:
But there weren't going to be any anomalies under your new system?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, that wasn't possible to be achieved, Howard. I mean, I am asking...you
can criticise me for doing a compromise deal....
SATTLER:
No, not just you.
PRIME MINISTER:
No, well, I don't mind if you just, you know,....
SATTLER:
Well, the Democrats....
PRIME MINISTER:
Okay, well you can criticise it but I ask you the alternatives were
a) to walk away from tax reform altogether which nobody wanted or
have....
SATTLER:
...or have another election.
PRIME MINISTER:
Can I tell you the Australian public wants another election like a
hole in the head. They're fed up with elections in this country.
We had one 8 months ago and most Australians to whom I spoke were
saying to me: look, if you can get a sensible deal that delivers most
of what you want with the Democrats, go for it. That's what they
were saying to me. They were saying it to me in spades. And not just
people in my own party, people in the business community. I have been
contacted by numerous people in the business community since I made
the deal with the Democrats, and can I tell you Howard not one of
them said it was a stupid thing to do. They all said good on you.
You got most of what you wanted. It's still a much better package
than the present system. Sure we would have liked the lot but we understand
the realities of the Senate. Now that's been the universal reaction.
Even might I say from people in industries that will have to assimilate
some of the anomalies of which you've spoken.
SATTLER:
Right, the Prime Minister's here and we've opened the lines.
If you want to give him a call you can.
[ad break]
SATTLER:
Prime Minister, just before the first caller, we've heard from
the council which is there they say for the disadvantaged in Australia,
ACOSS, today, your package, the package of a compromise package, they
say, and I suppose it wouldn't surprise you, they say is not
fair to low-income earners.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I don't agree with them and I think ACOSS is going down
the same path as the Australian Labor Party. They're taking themselves
right out of the debate.
SATTLER:
Pretty predictable comment.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well how on Earth can a package which provides a real increase in
the pension of 2%, and actually increases the compensation even though
basic food is taken out, how can that be regarded as unfair. I just
think ACOSS unfortunately has got itself into a hole on this issue
and just can't come to terms with the reality that the agreement
we've struck with the Democrats is not only fair but also preserves
the overwhelming elements of the original plan.
SATTLER:
Okay John's your first caller, to John. Hello John how are you?
CALLER:
[inaudible]
SATTLER:
The Prime Minister's listening.
CALLER:
Prime Minister, I believed when we voted, I thought that the petrol,
and all these taxes are going to be eliminated like excise, and those
sorts of things.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well there's been no changes in relation to petrol. The price
of petrol doesn't rise. For business purposes the prices of petrol
will effectively fall by 7 cents a litre.
CALLER:
When we first heard the GST came out it was, to me, we were getting
rid of all these hidden taxes.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well you're getting rid of the wholesale sales tax in full, and
that will go on the 1st of July in the year 2000. The financial
institutions duty will go a year later. The stamp duty on share transfers
will go as announced. There's been some delay in relation to
some of the State taxes, bank account debits and stamp duty on mortgages
and hire purchase agreements and so forth.
SATTLER:
But petrol stays the same?
PRIME MINISTER:
But the petrol stays exactly the same.
SATTLER:
All right thanks John for your call. And Craig's next Prime Minister.
Good morning Craig.
CALLER:
Good morning Howard. Good morning Prime Minister, how are you?
PRIME MINISTER:
Very well indeed.
CALLER:
Mr Howard I would just like to congratulate you on your negotiations
of an amicable agreement between you and the Democrats. Well done.
PRIME MINISTER:
Thank you. I appreciate that very much.
CALLER:
My pleasure. I just think that people have to realise that people
are getting older. Someone's got to pay the taxes. I only would
assume that income tax rates go higher if we don't this income
coming by taxing everybody if you like, which is a fast area tax.
And I find it hard to believe that businesses are going to lose turnover
and have to put off people because of this tax. I think people will
still get their bottom line if you know what I'm saying.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well they will, and the reason they'll get their bottom lines
is that families will be better off, they will be significantly better
off. Many families will be $40 to $50 a week better off because of
the very sizeable income tax cuts, the increase in family benefits.
And now that food, basic food is GST free, with the removal of the
hidden taxes the prices of some food items will actually come down.
SATTLER:
Thanks for your call Craig. And Arvo joins us now. Hello Arvo.
CALLER:
Howard how are you?
SATTLER:
I'm good. And the Prime Minister wants to hear what you have
to say.
CALLER:
Hello Mr Howard. Listen, mate, why don't you have another election?
PRIME MINISTER:
I don't think the public wants another election.
CALLER:
Well I'm part of the public and I do.
PRIME MINISTER:
Yeah, all right, well I respect your view. But you'll respect
the views of your fellow Australians. And the reaction I've had
from people is that they don't want another election.
CALLER:
The reaction I've had from a lot of people I speak to is they'd
like....they would vote for this GST legislation now coming in.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well there's a lot of people who voted Labor didn't vote
for it. No that's true.
CALLER:
True true, I agree.
PRIME MINISTER:
Yeah sure. They're not going to change their position.
CALLER:
Well why don't you have another one?
PRIME MINISTER:
Because it think when you can 85 to 90% of what was endorsed, it's
a failure of good government, a failure of leadership, and really
an unfair imposition on the public only 8 months after you've
had an election to go back to the public.
SATTLER:
Prime Minister, does it now mean too that tax reform will not be an
issue at the next election.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I would think it will be far less of an issue because....
SATTLER:
Because once in it can't be reversed can it?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I don't believe so.
SATTLER:
Well that's what Kim Beazley said.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I don't know. I mean I don't know what his position
is. I mean he just waves cans around.
SATTLER:
No but he said before this was introduced, he said if you allow a
GST in that's it, we can't reverse it.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well that's his position because that's having two bob each
way. He's saying "it's a shocking, outrageous, obscene
thing, but of course I can't reverse it. I'm happy to have
the benefit of it". I mean that