E&OE....................................................
SATTLER:
In fact he joins me on the line now. Good morning Prime Minister.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning. How are you Howard? There's still a bit of an
echo.
SATTLER:
(Inaudible)...
PRIME MINISTER:
The echo is back.
SATTLER:
All right we will immediately..., it must be something about Canberra
to Western Australia that everything that we say to you and you
say to us comes back.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well we always look after Western Australia extremely well.
SATTLER:
All right. Now the question people said........
PRIME MINISTER:
[inaudible]there's a lot of echo.
SATTLER:
But the question that was asked of me this morning when I said
we've got the segment coming up is how long is he planning
to participate in these?
PRIME MINISTER:
A long time.
SATTLER:
Not just till the election?
PRIME MINISTER:
Because whenever the election's held, I am quietly confident,
I'm not arrogant or complacent, I'm quietly confident
and I'll be very happy to come back after the election and
do it on a regular basis. It's not just pre-election flash
in the pan.
SATTLER:
It was only a sceptic that said that to me.
PRIME MINISTER:
Dear me. Well they shouldn't be sceptical.
SATTLER:
All right. Now given some of the statements that are made by politicians
from the major parties in the past 24 hours, the trade deficit yesterday,
is the electorate entitled to be sceptical that either of the major
parties are capable of successfully managing the economy of this
country?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well they're certainly entitled to be sceptical about the
Labor Party or indeed any other party on offer managing the economy.
Just three quarters of an hour ago we had some economic news which
showed the Australian economy has grown by 5%. I repeat, 5% over
the last 12 months. And apart from the current account deficit,
every single major economic indicator is running about as strongly
as you could have it running. We've got the lowest interest
rates in 30 years, we've got the lowest inflation in the western
world, we've got strong business investment, we've turned
a $10.5 billion deficit into a $2.7 billion surplus and overall
the economy is really performing well and we have given it security
and safety amidst all of this Asian economic turmoil. Now I don't
deny, the echo's gone, and I hope all the listeners are still
there, we have given it a great deal of stability despite the Asian
economic turbulence. The current account deficit is naturally going
in a way we don't want because....
SATTLER:
I was coming to that. $7.5 billion......
PRIME MINISTER:
The reason that that is happening is because our exports to Asia
are slowing down and we knew that would happen and that is all the
more reason that the other things that we have got right should
have been got right. I mean just imagine how vulnerable our current
account would now be if we kept Mr Beazley's $10.5 billion
deficit. Just imagine if Mr Beazley's economic policies had
been implemented. Our current account deficit and therefore the
entire Australian economy would be a lot more vulnerable than what
it now is. When you've got a current account deficit under
pressure you need a Budget surplus. When you've got a current
account deficit under pressure because of a loss of exports you
need the economic management that we've given over the last
couple of years. Not the reverse that was urged upon us.
SATTLER:
But the trade deficit of $7.5 billion this time round, surely that's
going to get worse as the Asian economic crisis really bites in?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, youve got to keep it in perspective. It's not
so much the dollar amount, it's the proportion it represents
of wealth.
SATTLER:
Yeah, don't try and confuse us here.
PRIME MINISTER:
No, I am not trying to confuse you but obviously a dollar 50 years
ago had a different value than a dollar today, didn't it?
SATTLER:
It sure did.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well there you are, I mean that's the point, you've proved
it. You've got to look at the proportions....
SATTLER:
I am not here to help you.
PRIME MINISTER:
No, I know you are not. You are here to interrogate me and that's
fair enough. But I am just trying to, you know, I am just making
the point.
SATTLER:
But surely the deficit will get worse before it gets better.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I am not going to make predictions about it. I acknowledge,
as the Treasurer did yesterday, that because of the Asian economic
downturn it's had an impact but you've got to look at
all of the solid indicators on every other front. And I say again
that if we had not got those indicators solid then our position
on the external account would have been a lot more vulnerable. This
is not a time for returning to the tax and spend policies of the
Labor Party. This is not a time to risk the Labor Party with its
big spending policies that will push up interest rates again.
SATTLER:
Are you happy that Gareth Evans is the Shadow Treasurer given his
statements yesterday?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I am not only happy he is the Shadow Treasurer but I am also
happy that his leader Mr Beazley is the Leader of the Opposition
because.....
SATTLER:
But he didn't make the blunder that....
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I tell you what, he made an interesting comment this morning
which I am just about to refer to. At 11:00am this morning I looked
at the wire and it had Mr Beazley talking about upward pressure
on interest rates. And right on cue, eight minutes later, the Commonwealth
Bank of Australia announced a reduction of 0.35 per cent on its
three, four and five year fixed rate home loans. In other words,
the Leader of the Opposition is saying in one breath, there are
market pressures pushing interest rates up and the market is giving
the thumbs down to his prediction eight minutes later and saying
they are cutting the rates.
SATTLER:
Have you got some friends at the Commonwealth Bank have you?
PRIME MINISTER:
No, well I know a lot of people everywhere. I have, I've got
friends all over Australia but I can say that within eight minutes
of that very negative uninformed ignorant prediction by the Leader
Opposition, the Commonwealth Bank says that it's cutting its
interest rates. Now I am not going to dwell on the reduction in
interest rates, I am simply going to dwell on the fact that so far
from the market believing Mr Beazley, the market is going in exactly
the opposite direction.
SATTLER:
How fortuitous.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I don't....this is a market matter. I mean eight minutes
later, right on cue, the Commonwealth Bank drops interest rates
eight minutes after Mr Beazley said our policies were putting upward
pressure on interest rates. The average home owner, Howard, is $300
to $330 a month better off, better off as a result of the interest
rate reductions that have happened under my Government and those
interest rate reductions are a direct result of the policies that
we have pursued.
SATTLER:
All right, now John Howard is not one who is given to personal
attacks on people but you described the views of Pauline Hanson
after a speech last night as deranged, erratic and ignorant. That's
pretty personal isn't it?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well it's factual.
SATTLER:
But it's personal.
PRIME MINISTER:
No, it's not personal in a sense that I am attacking her character.
It's personal in a sense that what she said in her speech was
wrong and uninformed and it was so wrong and that it warranted the
criticism that I made. I mean let me tell you what was wrong, I
mean, she first of all described what is an unenforceable non-legally
binding declaration as a treaty.
SATTLER:
This is the one on the rights of Indigenous People?
PRIME MINISTER:
Yes, on the rights of Indigenous People. Secondly, she accused
my Government of really conspiring to keep this secret. In fact,
my Government has adopted a very open process toward treaty making.
Thirdly, she suggested that we were supporting a policy that was
going to lead to taxpayer funded Aboriginal states in Australia.
Now can I just say that is ignorant. That is uninformed. It is wrong
and it is ignorant. Now what I have said in relation to Mrs Hanson
is that I won't scream abuse at her supporters. I will not
talk excessively about her, only if she says something that is wrong
or uninformed.
SATTLER:
But what does article 31 mean when it states that Indigenous People
have the right to autonomy or self-government over their own affairs.
I mean what does that mean?
PRIME MINISTER:
Howard, we haven't agreed to that.
SATTLER:
So we are not going to sign it?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I certainly am not going to agree to something that produces
that, I can make it plain right now. I mean we have already made
it plain months ago that we have a lot of reservations, a lot of
reservations about her policy, about elements of this declaration.
I mean it doesn't need, it doesn't need Mrs Hanson to
come along, exaggerate the situation, mislead the Australian public
about the behaviour of my Government. I mean I make it perfectly
clear, we are not going to agree to anything that infringes Australian
sovereignty.
SATTLER:
So you agree with her that we shouldn't sign something that
says that?
PRIME MINISTER:
Look I...well it's a question of whether she agrees with me.
SATTLER:
Well she said we shouldn't sign something like that.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well look Howard, I have made it perfectly clear, and my Government
has made it clear, that we are not going to agree to anything, anywhere
that infringes Australian sovereignty, full stop. And the idea of
there being a policy drive by my Government to have taxpayer funded
Aboriginal states within Australia, I mean that is what she said.
SATTLER:
Who do you regard as indigenous people in this country, who are
they?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people.
SATTLER:
But aren't they you and me too? Because the Oxford dictionary
she said, said that indigenous means you are born in this country.
PRIME MINISTER:
Howard, can I tell you that I am more interested in a common definition
that embraces all of us and that is the definition that we are all
Australian.
SATTLER:
Prime Minister, you've agreed to talk with our listeners as
well, so if you don't mind we will take a short break, pay
a couple of bills, and we will be back taking some calls.
Just one question Prime Minister before we get to our first caller.
I notice that you have, or they are reporting, that you personally
intervened to ask Spain to reject Christopher Skase's bid to
stay in Majorca. How come you've got involved?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well because I share the resentment of the Australian public and
I represent that resentment as Prime Minister at what Christopher
Skase has been able to do. And I want him brought back to this country
to face the laws of Australia. And I say that on behalf of a lot
of people who have suffered as a consequence of his behaviour and
my Government will do all it can to see that he is brought home.
SATTLER:
So have you spoken with the Prime Minister.....
PRIME MINISTER:
No, I've written to the Prime Minister of Spain. I did that
last week as part of a concerted Government effort to get this man
back to face justice in Australia.
SATTLER:
Has there been any response?
PRIME MINISTER:
Not yet but I would imagine that my letter will have some effect
on the attitude of the Spanish Government. I mean, it remains the
case that we're trying to get him back and we are going to
use all of the legal means that are at our disposal to do so.
SATTLER:
Do you think he is a con-man?
PRIME MINISTER:
That is a matter for the Australian courts to decide. I must restrain
myself in these matters but he has ....
SATTLER:
I'm talking about his health actually.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, look, don't... you understand there are legal processes
at...
SATTLER:
I'd like to be as sick as him.
PRIME MINISTER:
I don't want to say anything that will any way undermine the
legal case against him.
SATTLER:
But he reckons your Government is trying to kill him.
PRIME MINISTER:
Please don't provoke me.
SATTLER:
You're not trying to kill him are you?
PRIME MINISTER:
What's your next question?
SATTLER:
All right, well our next question comes from Lindsay on the open
line. Hi Lindsay, the Prime Minister's listening.
CALLER:
Good morning Prime Minister.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning Lindsay.
CALLER:
My question is with your statement the other day, or when you made
it a few years ago. The never ever' statement of the
GST. I'm sort of what you'd probably call a swinging voter.
I think what Mr Beazley and Mr Keating did with the L-A-W bit was
just as bad. But I think there's a lot of people like me who
can't, now, can't tell the difference between either party
because you lie... you don't exactly come and tell the truth.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, hang on, there's a huge difference. Mr Beazley and Mr
Keating made that L-A-W commitment. Then there was an election,
and then they did the exact opposite.
CALLER:
But so did you didn't you?
PRIME MINISTER:
No no. I haven't. Because what I'm now doing is saying
I've changed my mind and I'm going to have an election
to give the Australian public an opportunity to say whether they
endorse our policy or not. And if they don't like the fact
that I've changed my mind and I'm now supporting tax reform
in a comprehensive way, then they can vote against me. I'm
not getting in on one pretence and doing the opposite. I am in fact
saying to the Australian people, I now have a different position
on this issue, I believe that reform of this character is necessary
for Australia's future. Having gone to the people on a certain
basis last time, I'm going to put my new position to the public
at the next election. Now, they have an opportunity to pass judgement.
Now, I don't regard that as in any way dishonourable or dishonest.
I believe that to be as transparent as any political leader can
ever be. I mean, otherwise you'll have a situation where you
could never ever change your mind on anything.
SATTLER:
Well, perhaps you shouldn't use those words.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I mean, all right, if we are going to conduct national politics
on the basis of a grammar or syntax lesson, rather than on the basis
of people communicating policies before an election, implementing
them after the election and if they change their mind going to another
election before they have changed policies, I mean, we've really
got to conduct public affairs on that basis rather than on a pedantic
grammatical basis.
SATTLER:
All right, we'll move on. Our next caller's Clem. Hello
Clem.
CALLER:
Hello Howard. Prime Minister?
PRIME MINISTER:
Yes Clem.
CALLER:
I'm inquiring about the pensions.
PRIME MINISTER:
Yes.
CALLER:
Now, the basic wage went up a few weeks ago, and the pensions now
have dropped behind. When are we going to be brought up to scratch?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, Clem, that's not right. There was an increase a couple
of months ago, a special increase of about $5.80 in the pension.
CALLER:
Yeah.
PRIME MINISTER:
And that was a result of the decision of my Government to link
the pension to increases in average male earnings, average male
ordinary time earnings is the technical expression. Now that, we
don't have a basic wage as such, but I know what you are talking
about and in a sense that linkage is as close as you can get to
what we used to call the basic wage in Australia. And I think you'll
find that, at the moment, that the ordinary inflation rate or consumer
price index is actually not moving at all, but because we decided
to link pension increases with this basic wage as you might call
it, or male ordinary time earnings, we were able to lift the pension
by a special amount of $5.80.
SATTLER:
And Prime Minister, with the new indirect tax, which I'm pretty
sure you are going to propose, if it does cost pensioners more to
live, to go and buy their basic items, will you lift the pension
or make them exempt?
PRIME MINISTER:
I can give a firm statement that if there is any change in the
tax system, people on the pension will be fully protected in relation
to any increases.
SATTLER:
Compensated?
PRIME MINISTER:
Fully compensated, protected, guarded, recompensed, whatever expression
you want to use. We're not going to change the tax system in
a way that disadvantages low income earners, but we do want to get
more fairness into the system overall. We're certainly not
going to put a Goods and Services Tax on top of the existing taxes.
If we were to introduce such a tax it would obviously replace some
existing indirect taxes and overall the system would be, along with
personal income tax reductions, a lot fairer.
SATTLER:
Okay, just a few more minutes to go here, and Beverly wants to
talk with you. Hi Beverly.
CALLER:
Hi Howard, and good morning Mr Howard.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning Beverly.
CALLER:
I just wanted to ask a couple of questions about multi-nationals
and then I'll hang up and listen to your answer.
PRIME MINISTER:
Certainly.
CALLER:
Is it true that a minimum of $200 billion profit leaves Australia
each year, and that multinationals pay little or no tax on this
money, and that Australia is now 90% foreign owned?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I don't know where you've got those figures from
but multi-national companies are obliged to pay tax in accordance
with Australian law, and multi-national companies of course employ
many hundreds of thousands of Australians and provide them with
them with jobs and invest in our industries and those industries
pay tax and the people who employ them pay tax. Particular examples
of abuse of the tax system by a multi-national company or indeed
an Australian company when brought to my attention or the Treasurer's
attention, are dealt with.