TRANSCRIPT OF INTERVIEW/ TALKBACK WITH VINCENT SMITH, RADIO SAA
MARCH 1990
E& G0H PROOF ONLY
SMITH: Are you feeling a bit of pressure.
PM& No, I don't feel pressure, I realise that I've got to
work right up until Friday night, and I'll do that.
SMITHs Do you feel that things like this MFP row place
0 pressure on you, indeed diversions from the issues.
PM: I think it's a very unfortunate diversion, I think
however that the electorate will slot that into their overall
assessment of which side has addressed the issues and addressed
the real challenges of Australia's future I think we've ( lone
that, I don't think the other side has.
SMITHs You've had a very relaxed campaign it strikes ae, that
you've been taking it almost easy.
PM: No, I haven't taken it easy. I wouldn't insult the
Australian people by taking an election easy. I've put
everything I've got into it. What is true is that the actual
schedule has been not quite as demanding as in the past in one
important respect. We haven't scheduled so many fund-raising
dinners at night, and they can be, while a lot of fun, and I
enjoy them in one sense, they also take an enormous amount out; of
you, and the relative absence of those night dinners has made! it
V. somewhat easier.
SMITH: Have you been getting early nights?
PM: I've been getting a lot earlier nights than I normally
do in an election campaign, yes. I feel good.
SFIMS You're staying actually, you're staying in the Hyatt
Hotel,. next door to the casino, have you been across to have a
flutter, are you thinking of doing that.
PM: No, I haven't been to the casino, no.
SMITHiSDMiIdTH : y ou stay at Wrest Point
PM: No no.
SMITH: You're not having a flutter?
PM: No.
SMITH: I wondered whether you've been putting a price, some
odds, on yourself
PM: No, I believe others are doing that Vincent, bUt I
wouldn't degrade the process by doing that.
SMITH: Not long odds on.
PM: No, I just take the view that this is a tight election
and I've got to do as much as I can to really I've got two
things to do; to sell my own policies, the present and for the
future, that I've tried to do; I also have an obligation to
expose the inadequacies of the other side, the dangers in their
policies for the future of this couintry# I've tried to do that.
M~ ore than that I can't do.
SMITH: Do you think the odds may have changed with the
emergence of this MFP issue, this week.
PM: I don't think so. What that has meant of course is
that there's been, deliberately on the part of the Opposition,
from the end of last week, a diversion from the major issUes.
They chose to do that and that would seem to me to be unwise from
their point of view, but interestingly what it's done again is to
allow to emerge in the highest of relief the great internal
divisions within the Opposition. Let's look at it. You have Mr
Peacock, sometime on the Thursday, talking to some small elentent
of the leadership group, not including 14r Howard who is the
Minister responsible, and the word went out on Thursday night
that they had made their decision, to go against what they had
said just a matter of days before. Just last week, this is the
of ficial Opposition response in the Sydney Morning Herald, on the
question of the policy, I quote, this one short sentences " The
proposal is unique for Australia and deserves extensive
consideration". Nov that's the week before, that's what their
position was, then Mr Peacock gets together with two or three of
the leadership on a Thursday night, and they make up their minds
on the basis of some material before them, that they'll say no,
wfie it completely including the proposition that this has been
an enclave. Didn'* t consult Mr Howard. So what have you got
That rushed up little decision on the Thursday night, the Federal
President of the Party, Mr John Elliott, an ardent, vigorous,
enthusiastic supporter of it, Mr Greiner pushing like hell to get
the concept for NSW, now the National Party bloke in Queensland
damning Mr Peacock for what he's done. I mean you've got here
again, the successful Mr Peacock, successful in the sense of
PM ( cont'd) s putting up in neon lights, " I lead a massively
divided Liberal Party and Coalition". Some achievement.
SMITH Okay. Everybody seems to know better than the PM of
the country, don't they. The Opposition Leader knows better,
everybody out there in the electorate knows better, everybody
wants to run the country, don't they, but no one wants to be PM.
Why do you want to be PM again after 3 terms.
PMs Well let me say, give you a reason why, which is not
driving me. I can honestly say that it's not a question now of
marking up personal milestones, this country has given me the
immeasurable honor and pride and privilege of being its PM for
seven years and to be PM of what I clearly regard as the best
country in the world is something that's just enormous, and I
thank them for that. But I am striving harder in this election
to win than I ever have before I think, because I truly believe
that the policies that are being put by the Opposition are a
recipe for disaster for this country, domestically and
internationally. And I love this country that much, I mean the
whole of my public life and the whole of my adult working life,
has been public life, has been to try and advance the interests
of Australia, and I am as sure as I am of anything, Vincent, that
if the Opposition were to be able to come in and do the things
which they are promising, it would set this country back
immeasurably. I mean what do I mean by that.
SMITH3 We'd be on the road to a banana republic.
PM; Well you would. I mean you would certainly go into
recession because you look now four days from the election, they
have their hinge words, their linch-pin words if I can put it
that way. And what are they? Productivity, increased
productivity. But their policies are a recipe for negative
growth, growth productivity movements. A wages explosion,
there must be a wages explosion. Capital gains tax, they would
in shovelling billions of dollars into the pockets of the
wealthiest one per cent, that's not only a recipe for social
divisiveness, but it's a recipe for economic backwardness because
instead of investment decisions being made as they are now, on
the basis of productivity considerations what's the best economic
return, investment decisions would once again become how do you
increase the paper value of particular assets so that you can
flog that tax free. And this is the reverse of what productivity
dedision-making is about. These sorts of things in the area of
tax and the economy are a recipe for sending Australia back into
economic backwardness, social divisiveness and we've done too
much in the country together to come together, to become
competitive again. We're now exporting manufactured goods all
over the world. I mean if I can just go one point, which comes
out of Adelaide. One of the most exciting things that's happened
to me as PM. Just go to this enterprise here, in Adelaide, which
PK ( cont'd: s is a manufacturer of optic lenses.
SMITHi Sola Optical.
PM: Yes, Sola Optical, I wasn't going in for advertisiinrg.
Now I Just can't describe to you
SMITHs I'm just getting used to sorne.
Pt1h4a: t. TheYrees , I wweenllt iIn tcoa nth'ti s deesncterirbperi seto, ymoua gtnhiefi ceenxtc itreemlaentito nosf
between management and workers, and they were telling me the
Usaniidte dt hSeyta theasd, atbhoeu tm o1s2t ocro m13p ectiotimvep etmitoarrsk ett heinr e thine twheo rltdo, u ghtheiesty
market, and this Adelaide enterprise has over 50% of the United
States market.
SMITHS Do you think that's the beginning of this investment,
this capital investment in plant and equipment that's supposed to
increase our productive capacity.
PM1 I don't think it, I know it. I mean we've got ' the
situation now where under the Accord the Trade Union Movement h. 1as
allowed a movement to profits which has moved into investment.
We now have investment at the highest proportion of production
bteheant. it'Asn db etehna ti nn oowu ri sh istrtaonrsyf orm1i3n. g5 %,' o uirt ' isn dtuhset rhyi* g htehsat t'ist ' ws healvt'esr
been enabling us to have this massive increase in manufactured
exports. I mean a 54% increase in the last four years Vincent,
mIna nu19f8a3c tBuHriPe dw aesx pgooritnsg. to Thcel oscel asdsoiwcn ethxaem psltee, el stienedlu, strlyo. o k Naotw it. in
this last year we have exported three quarters of a billiLon
dollars worth of steel around the world, we're one of the most
efficient producers and exporters of steel in the world, and in
wthoer thn. e xt Atnhdr eteh ayte'asr sa sw ea' rere gsouilnt g otfo meaxspsoirvte onveewr i2n vbeisltmlieonnt dionl lathres
steel industry, in co-operation with the workforce. The second,
vell, an equally almost exciting thing of that here, Sola
Optical, was going to the BHP steel works in Newcastle at the end
of the last year, and there I met the management and workers
together, enthusiastic, excited about what they were doing
together. Management saying to me, look before this new periLod
since you've been in office, our attitude he said, these were his
weoxr~ desc, te do urth eamt titotu dlee auvsee d thteo irb eb riani nrse gaart d thteo tghaet ew, orkhee rss, a idth anto ww, e
under this new set up, he said we co-operate with them. We Itap
into them, get their thinking, he said we've changed management
oasnttetliyet lu gdoient , d ua sttshrtyee, ye ' lv weih nicdchhu aswntrgayse d fgoowrin ogrAk utosat trtabiletiu adc lebosus, et di ts'osd owwnea.' vge reWnaotew ' v sego ountr. co eta
of export income for us.
SMITH: You may it's happening now. How long will it taike
before we can say, good times are back here again. Is it going
to be the turn of the century. I miean a lot of people are saying
and writing that really this is a bit of a phoney campaign. Both
sides are saying things are going to get better very, very
quickly. PM: But let me when you say things are going to Slet
better, sure there've been hard times with high interest rates
over the recent period.
SMITH: Are you saying they will come down.
PM1 Even more importantly than I'm saying it# or that Paul
Keating is saying it, the banking industry itself is saying thiat
they will come down after the election. We've had to have high
interest rates because we were growing that fast, and importing
that much, that we couldn't sustain that level of imports but the
banking industry has said, okay what you've done was right, it'Is
working, and now the mortgage rates will come down.
SMITH: 2%.
PM: That's a decision which the banking sector has got to
make, but the important thing is that we've got the policies in
place, which are going to enable that to happen whereas if the
Opposition were to get in with a wages explosion, and with
blowing the budget surplus. See I've done what's never been done
before with my colleagues. In the last three years a 17 billion
dollar surplus. The Conservatives never got a surplus. Kow
that's important in terms of economic policy and interest rates
because that means we are reducing the goverrnent claim upon
savings and that opens up a greater savings pool for the private
sector so that reduces pressure on interest rates. But they're
going to blow the budget surplus. 7 billion dollars. I mean
S tfhroemy ' reth es ayeilnegc titoon , y ouorh ldisetaern elriss, t eannedr sw eo'rfe Voninlyc enfotu r Smdaiytsh aawnady
electors of Australia generally, please you know, buy us on
trust, we've 7 billion dollars of promises, which we haven't
funded, we either blow the surplus or cut your benefits
massively.* Now they must blow the surplus by increasing the
outlays and also by giving billions of dollars back from the
public revenue and shovelling billions of dollars into the
po'aets of the wealthiest 1 per cent. Now that's a recipe for
economic disaster.
SMITH: But on the other hand you're also asking people to take
you on trust, on your record-
PM: On the contrary, on the contrary. I said with Keating
last year, I said, look I'm neither a masochist nor a sadist, I
PM ( cont'd) i certainly don't want to hurt myself, 1 much more I
don't want to hurt Australians. I mean I haven't spent 30 years
in public life and now wanting to hurt Australians unnecessarily.
But we had the simple fact that in the last year we increased our
consumption by 8% and our production by 4% and we just brought
the rest in by imports so we had to slow things down. And I s'aid
to the people of Australia last year, this is why I've got toi do
its I've got to do it to slow things down somewhat, but I said I
guarantee you that that will work, we'll slow things down and. we
can bring interest rates down. Before this election started, the
Reserve Bank brought the prime rates down and now the banking
industry is saying yes, the policies are working and mortgage
rates will come down after the election. They're saying it.
SMITH: 2%?
PM: Well, it would be unfair for me to say it will be 2%.
1 believe that the forces are there, that is the reduction in
demand, and the lowering in the cost of money to the banks, that
means they must bring it down, now the amount that they bring
mortgage rates down by will be determined within the ' banking
industry. But I think it will be a significant figure and it
will be sustainable.
SMITU: When money gets cheaper, doesn't that increase demand
beyon'd our production level-
PM: No, no, no. The important thing is that we are having
restraint in wages, restraint in wages, we're not going to be
having a great boost, an enormous boost, in real disposab,) le
income, it's going to be an increase in real terms, but what
we're going to be doing, our efforts, our activity, will be more
and more going into net exports. I mean this is what's happening
now that Australia's productive activity, the increase in our
productive capacity which comes from having more people in work,
and higher investment, it means that we've got more Australians,
better trained and better equipped at wo,' rk and that productive
activity is going to be more and more channeled into exports.
SMITH: Our first caller.
CALLER. I'm waiting on a thing from the Taxation Dept answering
my accountant, and it's taking a hell of a long while to go
thxpugh, waiting on the ruling and
PM: Clare, could I just interrupt you# there's no way just
on air like this that we'd be able to settle this, but could I
give you this undertaking. If you'd send the details of your
concern into Vincent, and I'll have it sent on, I'll give you my
personal undertaking.
CALLER: Well we're still waiting and I'll tell you in a couple
of minutes why should you have to pay Medicare levy back to 1978
when it didn't come in until the 1 of February 1984 on your
retiring allowance.
SMITH: You shouldn't.
PM: And you're not being asked to.
CALLER: I've great respect for yourself and I don't wish to
belittle you but I say to you, would it be possible for you to
answer my question without all the statistics. I appreciate your
skills in the economic division. I'm asking you if you could
help small business. ' What are you going to do when the election
is over to stop this high interest rates of banks, so that we can
continue to employ our staff. In Adelaide we ate forced to put
off staff at the moment. Small business with a staff of three,
and having to reduce our part-time labor. If you continue to
allow these high interest rates that permeate through the small
business section to continue, it will go too far.
PM: That's right Arthur, and that's why it'. not going to
go further. I hope you were listening before and I won't throw
statistics at you, Arthur, I do that when I think they're
relevant to a question, but let me say this to you; that we had
to have a high interest rates during last year, the reasonsi I
put, I won't repeat the statistics, but we were simply consuming
more than we were producing and that meant we were pulling in
more imports than we could sustain, so I've had to have hiLgh
interest rates to slow the economy down somewhat, but
importantly, Arthur, that's been achieved nov and the banks are
saying that they will be lowering interest rates, as you kftow
already the commercial rates that are relevant to the bank's
decisions, they have come down in this year, over 2 percentage
points, and they have made it quite clear to the people of
Australia that rates generally will be coming down, because we've
got in place the policies which will enable that to happen. I
can assure you, Arthur, that we are going to continue to grow,
the economy is going to continue to grov, but as I was sayinq a
little while ago to Vincent, what we've all got to do and I
appreciate very much the role that small business plays in thiLswe've
got to more and more direct our activities in a way which
is going to enable us to substitute our own production for
im~ prts and also increase our exports because that's what's viltal
to-dealinq with our external problem. I can assure you, Arthur,
that the rates will be coming down after the election.
CALLER: Can I come back to you Mr Prime Minister. Well, what
about a tip for Sandown races today, you're an expert in that
field too.
SMITHtSWMaIrTwHi: c k Farm, Peacock is scratched in the second race.
PM: If I had a paper in front of me, I'd give you a ' tip
mate, I'm sorry I haven't got one in front of me.
CALLER a I want to speak to you in relation to your Immigration
policy. In Adelaide we've been fairly quiet backward sort of
country, sort of State, with the introduction of the
SMITHt Michael turn your radio off.
CALLER# We're getting a lot of drug problems now in Adelaide
now that we've opened up the state a lot, obviously it's coming
from overseas, could you tighten your policy up with immigration.
SMITH: Do you think we're not screening immigrants.
PM: Michael, you're not on the ball there mate. And I must
say while that there's been a lot of disagreement between Andrew
Peacock and myself on basic issues in this campaign, as I
understand it Mr Peacock's position is no different from ours on
immigration and I applaud him for that in that I think he agrees
with the level of immigration that we've got now, and if anything
he'd want to increase it somewhat. We have tightened all our
procedures in regard to ensuring that the people who come here
are going to be appropriate citizens and they are proving to be
that. You may be interested to know something I've Just
announced today, Michael. What we've done is to announce the
establishment of a statutory criminal asset trust fund and that
to put it in simple terms, all the proceeds from crime that we
get on convictions of criminal and under the drug-trafficking
provisions of the Customs Act, we're going to turn those, mll
that we get back from criminals will be divided up, 50% going
into the law enforcement agencies, and 50% going to programs for
the rehabilitation of drug users so that in increasing our fight
against crime in general and drug related of fences in particular,
we're going to make the criminals cough-up their ill-gotten gains
out of that, and that will go into the trust fund so that we can
even further strengthen our law enforcement agencies and the
pro 7, rams to help the rehabilitation of drug users. So I hope
you d agree with that.
CALLE. R: Yeah, I do, I think that's one of the best things thiat
come out, it's excellent.
CAJ. XLER t I've just been a bit concerned recently about all the
tafl about health policy. This is perhaps not as much in regard
to your own party but particularly the Coalition's policies or
lack thereof, as the case may be, they've talked a lot about the
problems that we've had with Medicare, I still think it's better
to have it than not, I was just wondering if you could tell me
what you're planning to do I heard Dr Blewett speak, he said
that there will be improvements made if you could just outline
some of them.
PM: Well basically, what we'll continue to do Jo. is what
we've done in the and that is to keep the basics of Medicare
in place and the basic is that there be equity and universality.
Equity that means Jo, that I because I get a relatively high
salary, will pay more than I guess you do, I'm sure my salary
would be higher than yours, I don't know what It is but I should
pay more, and we'll keep that principle that those like PM's and
business executive. and so on who have got higher salaries, by
paying our 1. 25% we will pay more and so we should so that will
mean that everyone in the community will continue to be covered
and we will never have it returned to that situation thalt I
inherited as PM, where 2 million Australians simply weren't
covered for hospital, medical bills, so it will be equitable and
it will be universal. The other thing of course that we wiLll
continue to do, Jo, is what we've done over 7 years we'll
Continue to consult with the States and with the people who are
actually involved in the medical system doctors, nurses and so
on, so that where there can be points of refinement, improvement,
that will be done.
CALLERt That sounds great, better than the other lot.
CALLMR I haven't been unemployed for very long, about a monith,
and I've listened to your speeches about training programs, they
sound very interesting and I would like to know, are you going to
put a lot on because I'm looking f or a job as hard as I can,
and these training programs are they going to be good enough to
get you a job sort of thing.
SMITHs Will they give you a ticket, is that what you're
asking. PM: What we've tried to do mate is to have a range of
programs because there's a range of people that need to be dealt
with. There will be some who come with sort of no experience of
S wthoerkm waet' vael lg, o ta npdr ogsormame s wwihtihc hn oa rtee cchanliccualla teqdu atloi fgiicvaet iothnoss e spoe opfloer
some sort of sense of confidence in themselves and the beginning
of understanding of what's involved in various types of work.
One of the programs that, one of the newer programs that we've
developed is SkillShare which I've seen around Australia now,
it's remarkable because what happens there is that people are
brought in who for one reason or another, haven't had much
ex~ erience of work, who might have some sort of disability, and
pebtle in the community who have themselves been tradesmen or wpho
know how to deal with people, and they are, these community
organisations are working with people to give them confidence and
experience. There's a range, in other words of programs, to
fit the needs of particular individuals. And I think that you
will find can I give you this specific recommendation how old
are you by the way?
CALLER: I'm 21.
PM: What you ought to do is go to the Commonwealth
Employment Service and ask them, just tell them exactly what
you're background is and you lot them know what your interests
are and I can guarantee you that out of the range of programs
that are available there, they will be able to point you to
something which will be of assistance to you.
CALLERs It seems like the opposition's not really
SMITH: Come back to us if -he doesn't.
PM: Yes he can. Well the Opposition want to scrap most of
these programs.
CALLER: They want nothing to do with the unemployment.
PM: What they're saying is I mean there's is heartless, I
mean after 9 months they just throw people out of the scheme,
what we say is yes, people haven't got an automatic right to a
dole, and that's going to be ended. But what they have a right
to from the community, is access to training programs, and that's
what we'll give them.
SMITH: That's about all we have time for, for calls. PM just
one question I wanted to ask you while you're going through the
Bandown form.
PM. a No, no, it's only because it's been put in f ront of me
and I've been asked to give a tip. Look this is done without
prejudice, and on the basis that I haven't really had a chance
to study it closely, but I don'It know what price this one
is. Have a little bit each way on Rave Report in the last at
Warwick Farm, just a little bit. I haven't been able to study it
closely, or at all. It's got a bit of a it" a way over Ithe
odds I think probably.
SMITHs As I said, Peacock is a scratching at Warwick Faim.
But I wanted to ask how you feel asking people for a second
preference vote, not for a primary vote, given the strength of
the alternatives.
PKI Well I feel this way. What's happening in Australia is
hajpening all around the world, particularly in regard to the
environment; that people are saying that's the issue that
concerns them most of all, and so, more people than before aire
casting their first preference for the party or parties which
they think are very, very much environment oriented. Now that
may be the Democrats, it may be actual direct Green candidates.
What I say to them is this. A, I share your concern about. the
environment; and B, if that is your overwhelming concern then you
PM ( cont'd) i must cast your second preference for the one of the
two parties that's going to form govtF which has got the best
environment record. And there's simply no doubt about that, the
Australian Conservation Foundation, the wilderness Society, have
made it clear, that to use their words, ' Labor is head arid
shoulders above the Coalition', and well may they make that
judgement because look at
SMITH: But why aren't you then saying well cast your firift
votes PM: Well I would prefer it, I'd prefer it. I mean I wou: ld
ask them to cast your first vote, but if they are saying we just
want to register our real concern about environment by casting a
Green vote 1, or Democrats, then, and this is a free society,, if
that's they want to do, okay, I prefer they voted for me 1, but
I'm saying to them, according to their own criteria then, if the
environment is the most important consideration, remember, that
it was Hawke and Labor, who saved the Franklin against the
Opposition of the Liberals anid National Party. It was Hawke and
Labor who saved the Daintree from logging against the opposition
of the Liberals and the National Party. it was Hawks and Labor
who saved the Kakadu from mining against the Liberals and the
National Party. It was Hawks and Labor, who saved the tall
forests of Tasmania against the opposition of the Liberals and
the National Party. So I'm saying to them okay, if you insist on
casting your first vote on environmental grounds for someone
else, make sure that your effective preference is for Labor,
because the AC?, the Wilderness Society, they all say, properly,
that we are head and shoulders, head and shoulders above the
Opposition. SMITH: Just very, very quickly, how importantly do you ralte
newspaper support, one way or the other. A couple of Murdoch
papers have come out in support
4 PM: Frankly I don't think editorials I think they
hardly change your vote. What's much miore important as far as
newspapers are concerned is that they give you a fair coverage
during the campaign. That's the important thing. If you get a
fair coverage from the newspapers during the campaign, that's
what counts, and if I mean I would rather have them saying vote
Labor in their editorial, than not, I'd prefer that, but I don't
think it really affects many votes.
SMITHt Thank you.
End