TRANSCRIPT OF PMES CONFERENCE Lon= O, 21 CONi 1989
E aO0E ROO ONLY
PM:' Gentlemen, what I'd like to do at the outset is to give
you, and refer to, the issues briefly and I'm open to any
questions that you would like to address to me on those
matters. The first subject of course was a mutual welcoming by the
British Prime Minister and myself, my Ministers and hers on
the fact of the meeting and the stature of the meeting.
There has never before been a meeting at such a high level
of Prime Ministers and Ministers which was indicative of the
importance that we, on both sides, attach not merely to a
strengthening of the bilateral relationships which we see as
ipoan, but also to take the opportunity to consider
together a range or international and regional issues on
which the percept ions of our two gove rnments generally
coincide. Without-order of importance I go to those issues
we mentioned and talked about.
I first of all say that I mentioned to Mrs Thatcher the
decision that we've made in Australia to recognise the
anniversary of Gallipoli next year. I have indicated to her
the plans that we will be following through to give to that
important recognition and Mrs Thatcher was very interested
in that and will consider the way in which they can be
0 involved with us.
It would be no surprise to you that I discussed with
Margaret Thatcher the question of the next Secretary-General
of the Commonwealth. I advanced to here the candidature of
Malcolm Fraser and the reasons why I and the Government of
Australia believe that he would be the most appropriate
selection. Let me say in that regard that our pressing of
the candidature of Malcolm Fraser involves in any
sense on our part of the qualities of the other candidate
I believe that the Commonwealth is in a fortunate
position to have two candidates of excellence, but it is our
view our strong view that taking all things into
consideration, that Mr Fraser would be an appropriate
choice. To be fair to Mrs Thatcher, she gave me no response
on that positive or negative, but I regarded it as*
PM ( cont): appropriate to advance that candidature and may
I say i'm grateful to Mrs Fraser for the very careful
consideration that she gave to what I had to say on this
matter. JOURNALIST: ( inaudible)
pm: We what was that?
JTOURNALIST: You said Mrs Fraser.
PM: Mrs Fraser did I say? Well, don't read anything into
that. N~ o, historically, Mrs Fraser's perceptions in this
area have been fairly sensible as I recall. You might
translate that to mean
We had discussions about the environment. I welcomed the
fact Mrs Thatcher has taken a considerable lead in greater
environmental matters, particularly with her hosting, here
in this city, of a conference in March on the question of
the ozone layer. We have agreed that Australia and the
United Kingdom should co-operate at the level of officials
in our respective pursuit of appropriate policies in this
area. we obviously had a discussion about the decision of
the Australian Government not sign the proposed Antarctic
Minerals Convention. I explained to Mrs Thatcher the
reasons for my Government arriving at that decision. Again,
this was an issue of course where Mrs Thatcher and her
Government had pursued a different position. They are going
through Parliamentary processes for ratification of that
Convention. However we explained why we took the position
that we did and I guess in that sense there was an agreement
to disagree as to processes, but let me say there is a
shared perception of importance of protecting that
important, indeed unique, environment.
A considerable amount of our time was taken up on discussing
the developments the tragic developments In China in
general, and of course in a particular sense, the
implications of that for the future of Hong Kong. We are at
one of course, in our unqualified condemnation of the
brutality and the repression which has characterised recent
times in China and most particularly most recently in our
condemnation of the execution of those Chinese-who are
associated with the train incident in Shanghai. That sort
of action is intolerable. It is a response out of all
conceivable proportion to the incident and, in our
judgement, should be unequivocally condemed as we do. We
discussed, of course, what should be the approach in the
future and I think it is fair to say that we share a common
view that we have, as I put it I think yesterday in
answer to a question in the city, that you have to walk that
line between, on the one hand, consistently and
PM ( cont): unequivocally condemning what has occured in
China. Secondly, at the same time recognising that it is in
the interests of the people of China, the region and of the
world, that the processes of economic reform should proceed
in China and it will be a question of judgement for us in
the West as to the decisions that are taken, that
consistently with our condemnation of what has happened
there, how we can assist, acceptably, in the processes of
continued economic reform in China.
In regard to Hong Kong, we discussed that issue. We share a
hope of course that the changes in China will be such that
what I'm now seeing as potentially enormous pressures of
demand from Hong Kong citizens for settlment in other
countries may change. But I have indicated that as far as
Australia is concerned we, in this year, doubled our intake
now of people from Hong Kong as immigrants to Australia. We
have, on the other area of concern in regard to Hong Kong
that is, the influx of Vietnamese refugees of course a
position where we are able to speak with very considerable
strength. I repeat there that we have taken on a per capita
basis more refugess from Vietnam than any other country
118,000 since 1975. We are in total agreement that the
situation now is a different one that the character of the
influx into Hong Kong from Vietnam is now not that of the
political refugee, but of the economic refugee and that
requires a different response. There is no justification
for any expectation in regard to those people and that there
should be the same attitude to the preparedness to absorb as
in the case of political refugees.
While I'm talking about China, we brought to the attention
of Mrs Thatcher and her colleagues the fact that there are
certain multilateral treaties that have been made applicable
by the United Kingdom to Hong Kong and also apply to China
its convention on the prevention of genocide, the
convention of elimination of forms of racial discrimation,
the convention on the political rights of wonen there are
two multilateral treaties that have been made applicable by
the United Kingdom to Hong Kong, but China is niot a party to
them. Those two are the International Covenant on Economic,
Social and Cultural Rights and the International Covenant on
Civil and Political Rights. We believe that pressure should
be applied upon China to have and become a party to those
two international conventions.
Next on the list, but not necessarily of course in order of
Importance, is the question of the Olympics the venue of
the Olympics in 1996. I indicated to Mrs Thatcher that the
United Kingdom has a city as an applicant for the hosting of
those events Manchester. We have Melbourne, and I said to
Mrs Fraser, I know that you'* re not wrapped in the system of
preferential voting in this country maybe in regard to
PM ( cant): this situation you will tikupt Lhtu view that ifE
Manchester doesn't get up, you'd give your preference to
Melbourne. We talked about Irido-china. The proposed Paris conference
and I think broadly we are at one in our hope that the
conference is going to lead to an effective resolution of
the tragedy in Cambodia and we indicated the intention of my
Government to participate fully in that conference and to do
whatever we could to assist, we engaged In some speculation
as to what would be the impact of developments in China upon
those processes and to the obvious conclusion that it is not
possible to be dogmatic about what will be the effect of
those developments i~ n China, on the position that China will
adopt in regard to these settlement processes, that we
express the hope that China would continue to play a
positive role in those process.
We spoke about the South Pacific Nuclear Free Zone. The
position as you know is that the Soviet Union and China have
agreed to the protocols of that agreement together
with France and the United states is not. I took the
opportunity of rehearsing and bringing up to date the
arguments that we see strongly the favour the question of
adhering to those protocols. I received no commitment from
Mrs Thatcher but they were she and the Ministers were
interested in hearing our assessment of developments in the
South Pacific region, developments which in my judgement
and the judgement of my Ministers add to the arguments
that were put before in favour of adherence to those
protocols.
We had a considerable discussion about the Middle East in
general and the tragedy of Lebanon in particular. We agreed
that every support and assistance should be given to the
three representatives of the Arab League, that is, Morocco,
Algeria and Saudi Arabia. The leaders of those countries,
as you know, are currently engaged in the process of trying
to get a method of resolution of the tragedy in Lebanon and
we agreed that every moral support should be given to those
processes in an attempt to bring an end to that now 40 year
old tragedy in Lebanon. In regard to the Middle East, of
course generally, we expressed the view that there ought to
be negotiation that the statements of Mr A. raf at from the end
of last year has created, with all the qualifications as is
appropriate for role to put upon those statements have
nevertheless created a different situation in which it makes
sense f or there to be positive responses from Israel.
we talked about the proposals for elections in the
occupied territories and expressed the view that they could
provide a basis I emphasise could provide a basis for
positive developments, but there are qualifications which
attach to that proposal. Those qualifications without being
PM ( cont) z exhaustive go to thle question of who would
participate in those elections does it include
Palestinians living in east Jerusalem, the question of the
withdrawal of forces from at least part of the territories
in the process of taking of that vote, the question of
international supervision of the vote, of course the more
fundamental question of what then is the stage beyond those
elections. So, the proposal could be seen as
providing some basis for a furtherance of the processes of
discussion and resolution. But of course, in themselves,
they are not sufficient.
We referred and discussed the developments in East/ West
relations in general, and of course the more recent
discussions are involving NATO and the positions that they
are adopting. We, to get a of the changed
environment characterises these areas, but recognise while
there should be a positive, constructive approach, caution
needs to be adopted in this area.
we discussed also the Non-Proliferation Treaty. In general,
we need to strengthen the processes of the NPT and we had a
particular discussion of that issue in regard India and
Pakistan, the delicacy of the situation between those two
countries and the desirability of adherence by them to the
NPT.
we also of course discussed developments in Europe and we
were at one. Of course, in expressing a hope that in the
post-1992 situation, that that would an open,
outward-looking development which would be characterised by
the capacity of countries outside Europe to be able to take
advantage of the development of that market of 320 million
people. I am confident that the government of the United
Kingdom will, in its approach on these-matters, adopt that
sort of conceptual idea.
We are agreed also that, in the broader-area international
trading relationships, that we, and all countries, should
intensify their efforts for the remainder of the Uruguay
Round up until the end of next year to try and get an
outcome which not only in regard to agriculture which could
be seen to be a matter of particular interest for Australia
as it is, but not exclusive interests, in regard to
agriculture and other questions of intellectual services and
so on, that there should be an arrival at a position which
is one of a siqnficant freeing up of the international
trading syste.
We had a brief discussion also about developments generally
in the South pacific and also within that overall context I
referred to the initiative that I began in Seoul in general
this year which is concerned with trying to get a closer
form of economic co-operation in that region.
pm ( cant): so i think, ladies and gentlemen, we will see
that it was an extensive discussion covering a wide range of
issues and I conclude as I began by expressing the gratitude
of my Governmen to the very constructive approach that has
been by Mrs Thatcher and her Ministers. We are fully
satisfied with the structure and the nature of the
discussions that we've held. We think they augur well, in
particular in the context of tomorrow's meeting of some 300
businessmen from our two countries, that these discussions,
in totality, augur very well for a signficant improvement in
what is already a good relationship.
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke, do you think the executions in China
is the start of a mass campaign of executions?
PM: I hope not. One can't speak with any great degree of
optimism because you have these factors to take into
account. one, the massacre of June the 4th and the
that followed. secondly, the campaign of fear, intimidation
and of an attempt to get Chinese citizens to inform on
others which is now characterising its society. Within that
framework and out of the decisions that have been made to
execute these Chinese citizens, one cannot speak on that
evidence with a great degree of optimism. I can only hope
that with the firmness of view which we expressed by the
rest of the world that the Chinese authorities will come to
an understanding that not only is such a course of action
morally reprehensible but in terms of a perception by them
in their self-interest must act in the interests of China.
JOURNALIST: Prime Minister, would you consider trade
or other further diplomatic sanctions against China?
PM: We would when I say we, it's not just Australia, but
other countries like us, including the United Kingdom. if
there was a significant worsening in the actions of the
Chinese quthorities, then we would all-have to look at that
and make our decisions in the light of it. All I can say is
that, clearly, we understand that there is a difficult
line to walk. We want, as I say, at one and the same time,
to have unequivocally in the mind of the Chinese authorities
the repudiation, the abhorrence that we feel for what
happened and we also don't want to have a situation
where, as a result of our actions, China is going to be
driven even more in upon itself and that the authorities of
China in those circumstances see their only course of action
as one of closing up to the West and pursuing a policy of
toal. repression within their own country. So these are not
going to be easy decisions, but certainly we are not going
to do anything which will give to the Chinese authorities
any impression that there is any condonation of what they
have been doing.
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke, are you able to say anything
more now on the speculation of dissidents being harboured in
the Australian Embassy in Peking?
PM: No, l've got no mare to add on that.
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke, on Hong Kong you said that
Australia's doubled its intake from Hong Kong. Mrs
Thatcher's government, the Foreign office, has said that
Hong Kong residents wanting to take residency in Britain
will either have to be select diplomatic staff or have more
than 150,000 pounds. Did you question her about this?
PM; I'm sorry I didn't get that, she said what?
JOURNALIST: The Foreign Office said that Hong Kong
residents wanting to settle in Britain will be eligible if
they're select diplomatic representatives or if they have
more than 150,000 pounds,. setting a monetary price on
the head of Hong Kong people. Did you ask her about these
issues, about the rate on which they are allowing Hong Kong
people to come to the United Kingdom?
PM: I didn't go to that specific issue. I said that the
question of judgement of policy about intake of those from
Hong Kong who wish to settle in the United Kingdom is, by
definition, a matter for decision by the government of the
united Kingdom. That is a matter for them as it is a matter
for my government as to what policy we ad opt. I have simply
made the point that in this current financial year we have a
doubling of to 800 of people from Hong Kong. We have an
element of our immigration policy which is called a business
migration program and that will continue to be feature of
our policy. We will continue to have discussions and
consultations with the government of the United Kingdom on
this issue. But, in the end, their decisions are a matter
for them.
0 JOURNALIST: But do think that the Hong Kong British should
havea rghtto seodabode, andifteBtshdnto
it, could the Commonwealth?
PM: The nmbers that you're talking about here are in the
order of three and a quarter million people and obviously
the united Kingdom would have enormous difficulty in
accommodating three and a quarter million people. it's no
good denying that obvious fact that they would have
difficulty. The important thing I think we've got to work
upon in to say to the people of Hong Kong and it's not
just the united Kingdom we've all got to say that
we've going to do everything we can to try and create
a situation in terms of decisions and attitudes that
are taken by the government of China that wili, through
time, generate a greater degree of confidence in the
PM ( cont): residents of Hong Kong that they can with
confidence remain in Hong Kong. But I'm not going to adopt
a position where I'm telling the government of the United
Kingdom what the level of immigration is that they have to
take from Hong Kong.
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke, did Mrs Thatcher give you any idea as
of her feelings about Mr Fraser's candidature for the
Secretary-General of the Commonwealth position?
PM: Yes.
JOURNALIST: What was it?
PM: I think that's not appropriate. There's certain areas
of these discussions which by definition must remain
confidential and I think if Mrs Fra Mrs
there's something that is worrying tie and now wait a
minute Quite seriously, I think that this is a matter
where if Mrs Thatcher has something to say that this
shouldn't be conveyed by me, it should be conveyed by her if
she wants to say something publicly.
JOURNALIST: Prime Minister,
PM: I can't quite hear you
JOURNALIST: today by Mrs Thatcher, we gather that
Britain push ahead with its intention to, as you say,
ratify, the Antarctic Wilderness Convention
PM: It's not the Antarctic Wilderness Convention.
JOURNALIST: Sorry, the Minerals Convention. we've all
got today
PM: but not as as mine Shut up.
0JOURNALIST: is it your understanding that Britain
will continue to bring pressure to bear on other nations to
follow her lead rather than the lead that you and France
wish to give?
PM: No, she's left me with no such impression. I think
they've made a judgement as to what they think is the
appropriate course of action is for them.
JOURNALIST: But is her proposed course of action to go
beyond the Convention as it now stands anid to try and
strengthen the safeguards within it, as I understand is the
Norwegian position?
PM: No, their process is already wnder way. I think it is
in the House of Lords now as I understand. She said
JOURNALIST: is happy with things as they would be
with the convention ratified?
PM.: Whether she's happy or not, I think it is fair to
her to say that believes that there is a process that's
been undertaken and that, in regard to what has come out
of those processes, there is a specific proposal and she
intends to go ahead and ratify that proposal, which is
obviously her right.
JOURNALIST: How much harder then does it make it for
you to achieve your goal, or the goal that Australia has
set of a Wilderness Park in Antarctica?
PX: obviously it be easier if the United Kingdom were
agreeing with usn, but Mrs Thatcher is exercising her
obvious rights in this regard. I regard it as a matter of
considerable comfort that we have received the support of
two very substantial countries, in India and France. I will
pursue this issue on the rest of this visit with the United
States and with Germany, and I'll carry the issue in
Hungary. I and my Ministers and my officials in all
relevant countries will be very actively pursuing this issue
and I understand we will have the support of a number of
international organisations which have applauded my and I
thank them for it which has applauded the decision that
we've taken.
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke, today your Treasurer Mr
Hiawke, could you Just clarify a point about Mrs Thatcher's
response on Mr Fraser. I thought she said early in the
press conference that she had given no reply and said later
that she had given some indication.
PM: No, what I've said. I said she did not say to
me yes or no, but as to the nature or inclination on where
she may be going and so on, and the considerations which
were important to her, that is a matter which is fair or
appropriate for me to comment on. That was what I regard a.
a confidential discussion. if she wants to say anything
publicly about the matter I doubt whether she does
it should come from her.
JOURNALIST: Would Mr Fraser get the job without her
support? PM: I beg your pardon?
JOURNALIST: Could Mr Fraser get the job without her
support?
PM: I suppose that's I think that what will happen
in this matter is that at some stage before the CROCG4
meeting in October, that it will become clear that one of
the two candidates has a clear majority and in those
circumstances the other will withdraw. I donet think
anyone would want a situation where, if there were such a
clear majority decision, that it then be battled on right
up to and into the CHOGM meeting.
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke is it fair to say that in your
estimation that Mrs Thatcher feels deeply about mr
Fraser's candidature?
PM: I think that I can say this, that I think Mrs
Thatcher is adopting a responsible approach to it and I hope
that that doesn't sound condescending. She has feelings
about both candidates, I think she is trying to work
through to a decision as to what she thinks would be the in
the best interests of the Commonwealth.
JOURNALIST: the harsh things that you've said about
Mr Fraser over the years you once said, for example,
that he was the man of cutlery of Australian politics, born
with a silver spoon in his mouth and all his time
stabbing people in the back. Are you totally comfortable,
as Malcolm Fraser's lobbyist, and what exactly
PM: z campaign manager as I've been described as.
JOURNALIST: And what exactly is your selling pitch when you
deal with someone like Kra Thatcher?
PM: In answer to that question, which I'm quite prepared
to, I can do it because anything I've said on this issue
with Mrs Thatcher is something that I'm on the record about
anyway. my position of course is well-known, that I
don't think that Mr Fraser is the-: perfect human being.
JOURNALIST: ( inaudible)
PM: Now wait a minute. It's not as simple as that
But I think that what we've got to look at in this issue is,
what is the position that he's seeking to fill, what
qualifications does he bring to it. Now# an yoU've heard me
say in the Australian Parliament and elsewhere on the public
record, Mr Fraser's record on the question of race and
colour is impeccable. He has, therefore, a moral basis, I
believe, which justifies his candidature. I believe that he
has a capacity to talk to with not only Commonwealth
countries but with other countries In the world
whose decisions will be relevant to the resolution
of the position in Southern Africa. But let anthis and
I think this is important for everyone to take ito account
P14 ( cant): who has to make a decision within the
Commonwealth the Commonwealth is not a single issue
entity. of course it is the case that South Africa has a
great importance and will continue to have until the matter
is resolved. There are many other issues Of importance for
the Commonwealth and throughout his public career, both as
Prime Minister and since, Mr Fraser has indicated as I
acknowledge a concern with these issues. For instance, as
you know, he's is currently acting as chairman of an
group which is concerned with commodity-. trade, in particular
as it affects African countries. So he has a range of
experience and commitment, and contacts which I believe
would serve the Commonwealth well. But that's the sort of
considerations which I think are important in supporting the
candidature of Mr Fraser. I repea as I've said before
none of those things are meant to imply any criticism of the
candidature of Mr think it is one
of those fortunate positions where the Commonwealth has two
very good candidates.
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke, today your Treasurer....
PM: I will come to local matters in a moment. Is
there any further matters before we go to Australia?
JOURNALIST: Did you discuss South Africa with Mrs Thatcher?
PM: Yes, we did have some discussion about that within
the context of talking about not only the candidature of
Secretary-General, but more generally we did some discussion
about that.
JOURNALIST: How much common ground is there between you and
Mrs Thatcher on South Africa in the light of the fact that
Mr De Kierk is coming here later in the week?
PM: He'll be here on Friday. I think he's already here for
a government meeting on Friday. I think this is the area of
common ground that we share an abhorrence of apartheid as
a philosophy and as it is practiced. * We have that como
ground. Where we have our differences is in the strategy of
trying to combat that and I don't think there's anything
more I can usefully add to that obeiervation, that fairly
states our position.
JOURNALIST: Prime Minister, while you were discussing
matters of the environment with Mrs Thatcher, was she able
to give you the British position on when they might accept
their responsibilities in cleaning the nuclear testing
sights in South Australia, Maralinga particularly?
12.
PM: The position there is that we are still engaged in a
joint exercise of officials and people with relevant
qualifications as to an assessment of the facts what needs
to be done. When those assessments are reached, then that's
the time for negotiation and so, because those Processes are
going on, there's no point in particularly going to that
issue.
JOURNALISTr: Mr Hawke, do you think the-Commonwealth
conference will be dominated by South Africa an the last two
conferences were? or are you making an attempt to vary the
menu a bit?
PM: Obviously South Africa will be an important issue and
the Commonwealth can't meet without South Africa being an
important issue. But I have the hope that it will in no
sense be an exclusive or totally dominating issue because
there are many other issues of importance and two, in
particular, I think will need to be very such on the agenda.
one of course is the question of international trade because
for the member countries of the Commonwealth, liberalization
of international trading systems in of fundamental
importance. And secondly, the question of the environment.
I think those two issues need to be very much on the
Commonwealth agenda as probably does the question of the
actual organisation of the Commkonwealth affairs the
mechanics of the and so on. I think we need to have
a look to see whether now at the end of the 1980a we're as
well organised as we might be on questions of internal
housekeeping as it were. Now those issues are all important
and 3I trust will be part of a fairly comprehensive agenda.
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke, about the question of
Secretary-General again...
PM: it does fascinate you all doesn't it?
JOURNALIST: Did Mrs Thatcher make it clear that she has not
got much enthusiasm for either candidate? That's one point,
and secondly, on your meeting with Mr Do KiLerk,, what is your
view on his idea of the great or, putting this
another way
PH: I'm not meeting with Mr
JOURNALIST: I'm sorry I thought you said you were
going to have a meeting with Mr Do Klerk.
Pm: No# I said Mrs I haven't got to that stage.
JOURENALIST: what is your view on this issue?
PM: In answer to your first question, thatos one you should
address to Mrs Thatcher.
JOURNALIST: France,-on the one hand, be prepared
to sign the minerals Convention and, on the other,....
PM: She didn't say much more to me on that than in
private or in our impromptu press conference in Downing
Street. 7
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke, back on China, now that the
executions have begun, don't you think it is tims the west
started to threaten in their serious sactions and don't you
think there are sane sort of non-trade sanctions you could
use such as banning flights to Australia or something like
that? PM: I go back to the answer I gave before, but I'll add to
it. But I go back to the fundamental point that I made, and
that is that we do have a difficult line to walk between
doing and saying those things which are going to make clear
our unequivocal condemnation of the actions. On the other
hand,' making decisions which are going to be in the
interests in China, in distinct from its current leadership.
And I've said, what I think is obviously true, that that is
a dif ficult line to walk and it is right, as in implicit in
your question, that the more evidence we got of brutality of
execution of the total ignoring of fundmental human rights,
the more difficult it is with any sense of confidence, to
walk that line. But, simply, in these circumstances where
there is still a degree of fluidity as to outcome, to just
say yes we'll make a whole range of decisions which is going
to close China of ff is not something which is necessarily in
the interests of the people that we want to help. I concede
straight away that that is going to require difficult
decisions but I hope it will be apparent that in my own
0 case, and Ilox sure in the case of Mrs Thatcher and others,
that we will desperately try and make the right decision.
Let me make this point. That as far as my country and my
government is concerned, there will be no decisions based
upon expediency.
JOURNALIST: Mr Hawke, on Vietnam
PM: Yes.
JOURNALIST: How optimistic are you about the Vietnamese
accepting refugees who are sent back against their will and
is 1-hprp nny pagnribility of Your 90vernMet aareeinq to
resume nid to Victnam baf-are thy uzn4 of Sopt~ mbez?
13.
14
PK: On the first question, I think Vietnam has come'to
understand that they have to accept the view of the rest of
the world that we are now dealing with a different
situation, that it's not one of political refugees but
economic refugees, and that the rest of the world is simply
not going to accept the flight of. people, in the sense of
particularly from North Vietnamese, as particularly in
regard to Hong Kong, who simply made a-decision that they
don't like the economic regime and are seeking a more
congenial economic environment and that the government of
Vietnam has; to accept that fact and it has to move to a
situation where, as people return, and that they participate
in an acceptable orderly departure program which is
consistent normal immigration flows. As to the question of
aid, we won't be meeting in any signficant way before the
time we mentioned. What we've made quite clear, in respect
of contact with Vietnam as far as, may I say, of ASEAN
countries and others that one of the outcomes that we hope
to see from the resolution of the Cambodian tragedy is a
preparedness on the part of Vietnam to open itself up.
There is evidence that that is what Vietnam wants to do, and
it's my firm position in judgement that, if Vietnam adheres
to its commitment to withdraw its troops from Vietnam as I
say, adheres to it go back, but if adheres to that
and take a positive role in trying to secure a final
settlement of the Cambodian problem, and itself then seeks
to have a greater degree of involvement with the rest of the
world, then it is in the interests of Australia and of other
countries to respond positively to that, and we'll prepared
to. JOURNALIST: ( inaudible)
PM: Sure. Is there any
JOUJRNALIST: Yes.* Mr Hawke, on the question of Souith
Africa, was there any mention of the. possible release of
Nelson 14andela as part of the deal to get the South African
government and the ANC to talk to each other?
PM: No there was no allusion to that.
JOURWALIST: Still on South Africa. At this meeting
have your differences with Mrs Thatcher narrowed at all
and how long did you spend talking about South Africa?
PM: We spent quite a deal of time talking about it. I
think its fair to say that Mrs Thatcher has a view that the
npw landerahiD in South Africa will be more responsive to
the prqcesmes of persuasion. I hope that's true. I believe
LJ.. aL wl). L web nood to noo. there io action, and not just
words.
JOURNALIST: Did your differences narrow at all this time?
Pm: I don't think that the discussion went to the point
where I could draw that conclusion. itts a matter that we
will have to take up further in the Commonwealth Heads of
Government context.
JOURNALIST: Did she then seek to persuade you that it would
be good a moment to lessen the pressure to give De
Klerk a chance and if so how did you respond?
PM: She made it clear that she sought, as I said in answer
to the previous question, that there was something of a new
and more promising environment. I hope that's true,, but I
repeat, unless there is action then that is not sufficient.
Unless there is action that they are moving towards a more
acceptable position, then that's the context within which we
and the Commonwealth have to consider what our position is.
0
W-b-
JOURNALIST: On domstic issues Did you know the Treasur,..
from the argument of a luxury tax on a question of tax rellef for
savings, which suggests that your pledge tat these matters along
with other would be given caeful, consideration is not all tha fair
dinkum, at least as far Mr Keating is Concerned. What
PM: You're in the unfortunate position, my dear Wrend, that I
have the transcript and as is so often the cas you put a slant
which in't accurate. Lets look at what he said as distinct from
your slou on it. " Well look, the whole question of about luxury
good taxe on simple lines is simply a matter of tast, and the
relevant phrase. I couldn't put it better myself. Now it is an issue
as the Prim Miniswe has said very much in the public debate and
wW'l have a took at it". Now, rve had the opportunity of seeing
the Treasum'es speech and his answers to questions. I simply
want to make this fairly brief statement which I hope will be an
end to the maflor and that we will have an end to glosses and a
consideration of facts is always useful. rve been away fr-om.
Austraia, now for almost six days, it is appropriateC that in the fihst
peidwhen we had the balance of payments question coming up
that rd be prepared to recognise within the context of that
economic problem the appropriateness to make certain comments.
Now, I jut want to make it clar to you that I don't propose for
the next I1I days of this visit to comment on every domestic issue
that may come along. I do want to say this about Paul's speech
and his answers. Firstly, I thought it was an excellent speech
which set out the Oconomic situation very clearly, the position,
how ever much you may try and create an impression to the
contrary, the impression is that Paul Keating and I are in
agreement On ecnoMmia policy. There's no differmne between us
and we had a long discussion on economic policy before I left and
beyond saying tha I am not going to conduct a detailed
exainaionhere on the other side of the world on issues that will
probably to anything when I have returned to Australia, but I
have emphasised as far as the; speech by Paul i concered I think
it was an excellent speech and I agree with it and we are as
indicated thai he is that if the issues are in the public demand
they wil be zamdned and I agre with him instinctly if I may say
so, in rep* a to this issue that tho public are about, it is
possible for an increase in taxes In relation to goods no one
personally including myself that ( inaudible) fundamental
answers to problem facing the Australan community about, that
is is one in which we have demands at a rate of 11% increase
and supply of about now that's the essence of the problem and
this paricular proposal is not going
JOURNALISTr. W Hawke, is it still your views that Australian
living standards will be maintained for this -yea and improve for
next year?
PM: Im gogto apatowhat Ijustsaid, I havesaid au rm
going to say about the domestic, political and economic issues. I
have prepared for the first couple of days ( inaudible) As far as rm.
concerned this is the time I ( inaudible) as much as i'm going to
and when I got back to Australi I am going to get right in to all
these economic issues together with Paul and we'll make the
decisions that are necessary to protect the Australian economy.
i'm not going to on the other side of the world to go on with..
issues. JOURNALIST: So you take that attitude because Mr Keating has
expresed ( inaudible)
PhE No, Mr Keating's o
JOURNALIST: ( inaudible)
PM: The position I've been putting is very simple and r've read
the spech and his responses and I find myself in agreement..
particularly in regards to ( inaudible) and the decision as always in
this manner predominantly reflect the outcome of the
discussions between the Treasurer and the Prime Minister.
JOURNALIST: ( inaudible) living standards across the board?
pm God try Laurie. rve saidallrm goingto say.
pM: what lesios ane you atakn back to Autala from Mrs
Thatchges handling of one. the economy hern ad two, Industrial
relaions here, particularly In light of the massive swing against
her at fte wecktud In the European elections?
pM: We havent come hems, nor rmn going to the other countries to
larn about the economic management. We do that better than
anyone ese and on the question of industrial relations In
partcula, all I can say is that as a result of out conduct of
industrial relations we've had a 59% percent reduction in
industrial disputes, almost 10% reduction in real unit labour costs.
We think we handle that area very wall indeed.
JOURNALIST; Mr Hawks, can you toil us why your taking this
decision not to comment on domestic issues while you ane
overseas? PM; rye told you why. I & aid that it seemed to me at the
beginning particularly in the context while we're waiting for the
balance of payments consideration that I knew that that was very
much in people's minds a3 appropriate to make some observations
in regard to that, but I just have my priorties very clearly worked
out, that is with that behind us what we're about on this visit is
the pursuit of Australias interests in a whole range of areas.
That's what rm going to concentrate ent and I've no Intention of
deviating from that. You know that when I'm back in Australia
you have ample opportunity of discussing those matters with me.
I know that's disappointing to you. but that's what the position is
going to be.
JOURNALIST: On a lighter note, what do you reckon on England's
chances in tomorrow's Teat?
PM: Iz this put in terms of n~ egotiating a wager or academic
analysis? I have said to others before, I repeat it for your benefit
before the encounters began I sent a cable to Alan Border, rm not
in a position of sending him instructions, but I sent a cable to him
which tend this, " good luck in the first Test, I expect to see you at
Lord's one up". Now he has done excellently, I wish all my quasi-
Instructions were so faithfully carried through and he's done very
wall. I expect an the evidence both of the pefor c of his
players and the quality of his captaincy and the nat= r Of the
opposition, I have no'reason to expect that the result which has
emerged from the first encounter will not continue to emerge in
the subsequent, ones. You may pick up one Test but you have no
chance of winning the series.
JOURNALIST: Mrt Hawke,
PM:-OK, ths is just about the last one.
JOURNALIST: Should Australia. play a leg spinner at Lords?
pm: should wesplaya leg spinner at Lords. have we got onebin the
sad.. 1' rma Hohnes. well rm not right up to date with how he's
1464P
been performing. We Sot away in the first Test without a spinner,
but I think it's one of those circumstances where in this country of
variegated conditions there may be some circumstances in which
the inclusion of a spinner off or leg, may be appropriate. I have
such great confidence in the way that they have conducted
themselves to this point that I am sure they will make the right
decision. Thank you.
ends TOTAL PAGE. fMB