PRESS OFFICE TRANSCRIPT 2 OCTOBER 1979
PRESS CONFERENCE, HOBART
Prime Minister
and they were very useful discussions and I had a few friends
waiting for me downstairs. I think it must have been too much
for the Labor Party when we had a demonstration on my side
earlier today over some environmental matter and the demonstration
reverted to type as I came into this building. That's why I don't
have a coat on and don't have a tie on, so I hope you will forgive
me for that.
But we have had a very useful meeting of the Cabinet and the
Ministry this m~ orning. A number of decisions have been made
and we have had very useful discussions with the Premier and
-the Deputy Premier this afternoon, including discussions with
a delegation about the Tasmanian airfares.
It is * worth noting that Mr Lowe went out of his way to
praise the working relationship that has been established with
Kevin Newman on Tasmanian-Commonwealth problems. He welcomed
the very real financial committment that the Commonwealth
government has made over a significant period of time to
the Callaghan Report and to the implirnentation of a wide range
of measures under that Callaghan Report. I obviously welcome
Mr Lowe's somewhat belated recognition of the Commonwealth
for these particular matters, and quite plainly the Commonwealth's
comm-ittment is there, and our support for Tasmania through
a variE-2ty of programmes will be continued.
Mr Batt it was very ecumenical also went out of his way
to praise the government for its implementation of the Callaghan
Report and for the Freight Equalisation Scheme which has been of
such enormous benefit to Tasmanian manufacturers and to
Tasmanian primary producers.
It is very pleasing to note that the Premier and Mr Batt both
have such a high regard for Commonwealth policies in relation to
the State of Tasmania.
A number of decisions have been made which ministers
can expand in answer to your questions if you would like them
to. We are going to charter a vessel to undertake two special
cruises in 1979-80 for exploratory fishing around Macquarie,
Heard and MacDonald Islands. This is a part of the general approach
to survey fish resources in the 200 mile zone around the
sub-Antarctic Islands. The programme we hope will obviously
locate new resources. We hope also that the State might provide
some finance in relation to this because successful exploration
oquld give a * significant boost to fishing and to the processing industries,
especially in Western Australia and Tasmania. It is part of the
general approach that the government has adopted to exploration
of the Australian fishing resources that in this instance the
decision should be of particular advantage to this State. ./ 2
-2
We are going to construct a Commonwealth law courts building in
Hobart. It will be a new complex. we have given approval for
the design and development to a stage where it will be submitted
to the Parliamentary Standing Committee on public works.
Now, the building will . house the Federal Court, the Family Court,
the Arbitration Commission and the Administrative Appeals Tribunal.
The cost is likely to be in excess of $ 8 million so it is quite
a substantial committment. The law courts will be situated in
Davey Street, near some of the most historic architecture in
this city.
TAA and Ansett have been negotiating for some time with Qantas
in relation to the Hobart-Christchurch airlink We now have
a proposal from Ansett in relation to their negotiations with
Qantas and that means there is something firm that can be put
to New Zealand. Now, the Commonwealth will be doing that. It will
be supporting it, and we hope very much that we will get New Zealand'
agreement. The matter has been held up to this point because
there was a question of subcharter arrangements between Qantas
and the domestic airlines and a question of them working out
arrangements and putting firm proposals to us.
Ansett has done that. We would hope that TAA will follow suit,
but we now have something firm to put to New Zealand so it will
be processing that.
Peter Nixon advises me that once there is approval, whatever
changes are needed at Hobart airport are unlikely to delay
implementation of the new service. He believes that it would
not delay the implementation of the new service and we would
regard it as a facility that would be of very great benefit
to Tasmania. It ought to enable this State to expand its
tourist potential very greatly indeed. The Tasmanian government
has agreed in the discussions this afternoon to contribute to the
cost of improved facilities at the airport.
So that matter is progressing quite well, and we certainly won't
be losing any time in putting it to New Zealand. Their air
traffic people are at the moment in other international
negotiations. The only delay that I could see is the
readiness and capacity of New Zealand to negotiate with us, but
we would be asking them to pursue this matter as soon as can be.
There are other matters which are not of specific Tasmanian
interest but which I think are of general interest where we
have made decisions today. In the Budget we announced a decision
to exempt from sales tax equipment designed and manufactured
expressly forthe use of blind or deaf persons. Now, some other
elements of equipment had already been exempt as I am advised,.
but we wanted to make sure that the exemption extended to equipment
used by handicapped people, generally. We have now made a
decision to exempt a full range of the equipment. It will
certainly include such things as manual controls for vehicles
and other aids designed for use by disabled persons.
Senator Guilfoyle and the Finance Minister will be working
out the full details of the list, but I think it will be a
useful additional assistance to handicapped persons generally,
not just an assistance to blind or deaf people. / 3
-3
That is a change or innovation which I hope everyone would want
to support. For some time there has been a time limit on the
continuation of the Homeless Persons Assistance Programme and
this has provided assistance to a very large number of people
who have got into difficulty over recent times. There is a
restriction on the time limit of the present Act. What we are
going to do iS remove the limitation of time for which the
Act will have effect. Decisions will be made later about
the contin~ ued funding and the extent of Commonwealth funds
that will go to the programme. But, what we have in fact decided
is that rather than having a finite period to the life of those
programmes, the programmes will in. fact be continued. We will
be making this perfectly plain in our own legislation.
At about the time of the budget, the point was put to us about
sales tax exemption for small businesses. It was put to us against
the background of people who produce arts, craft work, people
who often work in their own homes. The present exemption levels
are $ 1,000 for goods made exclusively in the manufacturers own
home, and $ 1,400 for goods made elsewhere not exclusively in
a person's own home. The exemption limits had been set I think
in the early 1940s, certainly a very, very long while ago. The
exemption limits were partly for administrative reasons so that
you are not going to try and collect sales tax from a whole range
of very small manufacturers, but when it was originally introduced
it was something which had a particular benefit to the people
making arts and crafts of different kinds and representations
had come ' to us, especially over the last several weeks in relation
to these matters.
Well, now we have examined it and the old exemption limit of
$ 1,000 is going -to be raised to $ 12,000. It applies-to all small
businesses but in achieving or establishing the new exemption
limits we have in mind in particular the case of people making
a livelihood out of arts and crafts, producing things
own handiwork. THat also will be welcomed by a quite significant
group of people.
There is an addition to that an annual tax liability exemption
which will be raised from $ 100 to $ 250.: The two figures are not
specifically related the last figure is, I think, really for
administrative convenience.
Two or three weeks ago, Andrew Peacock announced a special aid
programmes to Kampuchea as part of an international effort, and
he did that against the background of a growing knowledge of a
very serious and tragic circumstance in Kampuchea but also against
the background of a very real concern that the aid we provide
gets to as many people as possible in Kampuchea who need the aid.
We obviously don't our aid to go the Vietnamese army or to
the military forces. We want it to get to people who have been
penalised and deprived over a very long period of fighting and
a very long period of difficulty, growing first out of the
activities of the Pol Pot regime, secondly, out of the activities
of the Vietnamese invasion. The earlier announcement made by the
Foreign Minister did come out of existing aid funds.
We have decided to provide a further
$ 2 million over and above that earlier commitment . because of
the seriousness of the general position of Kampuchea. Having
said that, we do remain very concerned that the funds we provide
should get to those who need it. International supervision will ./ 4
-4
certainly be necessary in Kampuchea and that it doesn't go to
the military and get used in a sense, to support military
activities. The other matter which is, -I think, of general interest -rthere
has been experimental ethnic television . undertaken over
the last several weeks. There is an Ethnic Television Review
panel chaired by Mr Frank Galbally, and there have been
recommendations that the experimental programme should be
continued.
Now, that is going to be continued. Sums will be provided as
necessary for the continuation. We hope increasingly there will
be comments and criticism of the programmes so that when
the ethnic television does come to be launched with its
own separate channel, the programmes can be as best advised
as possible to meet the needs and wishes of Australia's
ethnic communities.
I also want to make the point that I think some of the best
ethnic television programmes will be ones which are attractive
not only to people who have come to Australia in the years
since the last World War, but ones which all Australians will
want to see. For example, I think there is considerable
benefit in all Australians having a better understanding
of the history and background of many Austalians who have their
origin-s from Greece or Italy or other overseas countries.
The day. is long passed when it was good enough for people to
learn British history, ancient and modern, and Australian history
since the foundation of Australia we need to have a wider
understanding of the backgrounds of the many countries from
which many Australians have now come. There will be opportunities,
I would hope, for ethnic television to achieve that kind of
objective. In other words, the best ethnic programmes I
believe ought to have an appeal to wide body of Australians,
not just to one particular group, people from one particular
country. Ithink that is about all the decisions that we made this
mornir~ g, specially of particular interest to Tasmania,
and secondly, some decisions that we have made of wider
national interest. The Ministers concerned will be issuing
their own more detailed press statements on all of those
particular matters. If you have any questions
Question: It was suggested in one press report this morning that one
of the reasons for the government or cabinet considering
some of these Tasmania decisions is because the government
believes that there is an 80% chance of a State election
in the next five weeks over the constitutional crisis. Does
the government in fact, believe that there is an 80% chance
of ( inaudible) and secondly do you believe the Liberal Party
in Tasmania should try to force an election through the
constitutional...?
Prime Mini-ster:
I am not going to comment on what Parties in this State
may or may not do. For what it is worth, my own hunch is
that an election is exceedingly remote, if for no other
reason than I am sure Mr Lowe doesn't want one.
Question: Have you spoken to Mr Pearsall about the prospects of an election
or whether the Liberal Party...?
Prime Minister:
Not in detail, no. It is a State matter so far as we are concerned.
These decisions have been made. I think it ought to be noted
that over a continuous period we have made a whole stream
of decisions as a result of the Callaghan Report as they
affect Tasmania. A number of matters were announced in the
last budget. The decisions were taken significantly before
the State election but we were ( slightly forced?) to announce
them out of time so when we came down here and assisted
the State during the election we knew what the decisions
were going to be in the budget. But of course they weren't
mentioned and there were a number of ones, as you know,
including the beginning of the construction of the second
Hobart bridge which means a great deal to this city.
The development of the special programmes for this State
have proceeded on a continuous basis. As we have been able
to make the decisioins, so they have been announced.
You have the main Freight Equalisation scheme itsi-lf
shortly approaching the total commitment of about $ 60 million,
the Antartic Division which Michael Hodgman and others have
fought so hard for, the Launceston general hospital, the second
Hobart bridge, the air pollution station at Cape Quinn, Then
there are the additional funds for the native forestry development
programme, grants towards the Tasmanian fish centre in Hobart,
a loan to assist with the pilot industrial state at Legana,
sums for the Launceston Precision Tool1 Pnnexe, and a very
significant grant as part of a seven year programme-to assist
with the restoration of Port Arthur. So you have a whole
stream of programmes that have been announced over a period
and-what we have announced today is consistent with that.
Question: In your view, what is the best course to be followed to solve
the constitutional crisis?
Prime Minister:
In Tasmania? I don't want to offer a view about that. It is a State
matter. If you would like to ask me about Federal matters I would
be very happy to give you a view, but they don't condern the
Commonwealth and it would be gratuitous of me to offer a public
view on the matter.
-6
Question: Did Mr Lowe tell you he didn't want an election?
Prime Minister:
It is my judgement that he doens't want election for very
obvious reasons.
Question: How do you feel personally when you are subjected to the sort of
scenes you saw below?
Prime Minister:
I just get slightly annoyed about it. You know, people ought
to know how to behave and people can make a point if they
want to. I think one or two people were probably surprised
and; annoyed that there was a demonstration when I arrived here
this morning which was a friendly one wanting assistance from
the Commonwealth, wanting assistance from myself, and I'
suspect the Labor Party made a decision somewhere or other
that it has got to alter that kind of appearance. I remember
when there was a function at the Wentworth in Sydney when
the police were quite inadequate as they were down here in
at least making a path you could walk through which I think
is a reasonable enough thing to expect. I suppose 50 or so
peeple going into the Wentworth in Sydney had tomatoes or
flour or whatever thrown over them but the Opposition in
the Federal Parliament knew that that demonstration was going
to take place long before it did. Under those circumstances
I think it is perfectly plain that some elements in the
Opposition have been involved in organising that particular
demonstration because I think they knew about it before any
of the agencies, of the Cornmowealth knew about it.
Question: Do incidents like this perhaps make you think twice before you
appear in public?
Prime Minister:
Good heavens no. I have had a rule for a long while -I go in
a front door and I go out a front door, and I expect the police
to have whatever arrangements are necessary to enable that to
take place. There have been one or two difficult circumstances
at Monash University for example. The Liberal students at
Monash make a habit of asking me back just to demonstrate
that nobody is going to get run off that particular campus
and I will be back at Monash sometime in the early part of
next year.
Question: ( inaudible) / 7
-7
Prime Minister:.
I would believe that it is well within the capacity of the
State Police.-normally the New South Wales Police have in fact,
been very good, and you-know, are much better than some others.
The occasion at the-Wentworth was the only time I have known
in which the New South Wales Police have not been adequately
prepared. They just did not have enough* numbers there. It must
have been a great inconvenience, not only for the people going
to the . f unction that I was-going to but the whole entrance
of that side of the Wentworth Hotel was blocked off. These
matters are well'within the capacity of the State Police,
I don't imagine they will want to get caught short again.
Question: Are you satisfied with the way the State Police handled it
here today?
Prime Minister:
There weren't enough-' numbers. It wasn't handled the walk throughand
everyone got either rotten eggs or tomatoes thrown over them
which nothing more than annoying but it is not a very intelligent
way of demonstrating a point of view.
Question: A question on the Ministry, if I may how long can you realistically
keep, reserve a place in the Ministry for Mr Sinclair?
Prime Minister:
There is an assumption inherent in that question I will watch
Peter Nixon, and if I think he is getting a bit tired, I will have
a word with, but I don't think he would.
Question: So you are prepared to let it go for months?
Prime. Minister:
I think everyone should relax.
Question: you would hope for a resolution to the Finnane inquiry..?
Prime.. Minister:
The'New South Wales government is now in very, very real difficulty
because they have published a report which universally is
recognised as one that has been-handled in a. very improper way
by the Attorney General in New South Wales. Let me just repeat:
The evidence was taken in private, the witnesses were not subect
to a normal cross-examination, their evidence was not tested,
the person who was being accused didn't get a chance to answer
the allegations, and as a result of that, somebody came to certain / 8
-8
Prime Minister: Ccont. 1
conclusions and made certain findings. That doesn't make them
facts, it might make them the opinion of one person. But the
document is not a legal document, it can't be presented to a cXurt
of law, evidence would have to be presented again where it could
be properly tested, where the witnesses could be checked, where
their credibility could be under question, and inspite of
that, the New South Wales Attorney General rushed to publication
of the report. A large number of copies were made available
to the press. I am advised by that reliable journal, the Financial
Review, that there was a press lock-up, and that. public. servants were
busy pointing out the bits most damaging to Mr Sinclair. That
doesn't seem to me to have much at all to do with the course of
justice -it might have a great deal with the course of injustice,
it might have a great deal to do with politics, and it certainly
is a subversion of the normal processes of the law.
So we have a situation in which a report damaging to Ian Sinclair
has been left in the air and the only way Ian Sinclair can,
as it is at the moment, answer it by his own statement in the
Parliament, by a further statement statement if he feels that thatis
necessary.
The ought to be a prosecution so that the matter can properly
be tested. The New South Wales government is not prepared to
prosecute. It ought to repudiate that particular report. The
issue now is certainly one as to whether or not the New South Wales
government and Mr Wran in particular because he must be resonsible
for pursuing a course which is denying justice to a person in
Australia. Whatever -Australians might feel on a particular matter,
I think we have all got a view of basic justice the right
to a fair trial is the right of every Australian. There is
also a right to be assumed to be innocent until proven guilty.
Now, it would appear that the whole purpose of the operation
undertaken by the New South Wales government to create the
presumption of guilt before there had even been a charge
laid, before there had been an attempt to get the matter into
court and there is a great principal underlying this.
Certainly this involved somebody who is senior member of my
government, 1but if there can be an effort if it is allowed to
be successful to destroy Ian Sinclair's reputation as a result
of the activities of Mr Walker and Mr Wran, that can happen
to any citizen of the Commonwealth. There is a process available
that can destroy any person, any corporation if the same
processes are pursued and there is not the course to law,
there is not the course to the normal processes to enable
a person' s innocence to be proved or disproved one way or another.
So, underneath the Sinclair affair and the Finnane report, there
is an enormously serious principle which the activities of Mr Walker
and Mr Wran have put in jeopardy. that is a principal which is
basic to the normal human rights of every Australian. I believe
increasingly, as the days pass, people will be looking to Mr Wran
to see how he is going to address that, and allow the rule of
law to properly and fairly upheld. As I have said before,
every day that that particular report is left in the air, matters
are left as they -are, is a day which condemns the very being of
the New South Wales government itself. ./ 9
9-
Prime minister: ( cont.)
None of that is a question of whether it is ultimately right or wrong.
It is a question of his right to have a fair trial. That is the
issue now, and without the right to a fair trial, there is no
justice, there is no fairness and no ultimate liberty in Australia.
That just underlines the great principal that lies behind the
perversion of justice that has been perpetrated by the-New South Wales
government. I know quite well that there have other inquiries conducted in
the same manner but it is a question of what happens to those
inquiries how they are used, how they are exploited.
Let me just make one point which I think, hasn't much been in
the public domain. Whatever one might say of Mr Finnane, nobody
has doubted his association with the Australian Labor Party.
I would have thought that an Attorney General with devout belief
in the law and the rule of law, and with the devout belief in
his responsibility to adminitter that law without fear or favour
and with total impartiality., if he really felt it were necessary
on advice from the Corporate Affairs Commission which I suspect
he did not have, on advice from his Crown Solicitor which I suspect
he did not have, but if he really believed that on advice there
ought to be an inquiry launched against somebody who was plainly
a very significant political figure, then surely he ought to
lean over backwards to pick somebody with no political affiliations
who has not been associated with our Party, with the National Party,
or with the Labor Party, for the conduct of that particular
inquiry so -that there could be integrity in the general motives
of the Attorney General who launched the inquiry.
What I am saying in itself is not a criticism of Mr Finnane,
it is a criticism of the Attorney General, and it is criticism
of the New South Wales Government, which has of its own actions,
created a set of circumstances which is certainly open to
the use of its legal and quasi judicial processes as
inspectorial procedures for political purposes.
It will be up to the way the New South Wales government behaves
from this point on and without too much delay which will prove
or disprove whether that possibility is a real one or whether it
is not.
Question: . t~ hief New South Wales government repudiates the Finnane
report ( inaudible) . Will you invite him back?
Prime Minister:
Let'Is take one step at time. I have already said if these matters
are dismissed. Ian Sinclair is an extraordinarily able person and
all his colleagues would be delighted to have him back of
course we would. But what I am putting doesn't go to Ian Sinclair's
innocence or Ian Sinclair's guilt. Let me make that quite plain.
If there are matters to be answered, they need to be answered.
What it does go to is his right to a fair and to a free trial,
the right which is basic to every person in this nation, and
what person could there be in New South Wales now, who has not
10
Prime Minister: ( cont.)
been influenced by the activities of the New South Wales
government by the conclusions and findings or opinions of
Mr Finnane. There has been so much of it. How would you
find people. How would you find a jury that has not been influenced.
When you get somebody of Mr Ellicott's legal standing saying
in a Parlimentary debate something of that kind, we can understand
the seriousness of the situation that has been created, going
far beyond the particular allegations in relation to Ian'Sinclair.
It goes to something that is fundamental in our legal, judicial
inspectorial situation, and one which the New South Wales
government by'-its action to this point, has put injeopardy
by the New South Wales government. It is the government that
is on trial at the moment and Mr Wran will have to look very
carefully at how he acts. It is not good for him to say
that it is going to be Mr Walker's responsibility. Mr Wran will
have to carry the can for this one.
Question: Can I ask you about a State problem After meeting with the
delegation this morning, how do you feel about setting up a
commission of inquiry looking the disadvantages caused by
airfares to and from Tasmania?
Prime Minister:
Well, of course, we did establish the Callaghan inquiry before
which made a series of recommendations and we have made some
very substantial decisions as a result of that particular
inquiry. We have been given a submission by the Premier
and by other people from this State. Peter Nixon responded
briefly, explaining the current situation but he is going to
examine that submission in detail as it is a lengthy document
and he will be reporting the Commonwealth government in relation
to it. I don't think I can say anything more than-that at the
moment. You will. have to wait for that report from the Commonwealth
and we will take it from there.
Question: Can you comment on the situation with the Tasmanian College
of Advanced Education closely down... ( inaudible). Is Senator
Carrick looking at this, do you know?
Mr* Newman:.
I think that rests entirely with Mr Holgate.
Question: Do you find it rather strange or hypocritical of the Tasmanian
government on each occasion to come to Hobart to talk to the
Premier who apparently said... ( inaudible). ./ 11
11
Prime Minister:
I hope you don't put inverted commas around that word, ' apparently',
he did no apparently about. There were a lot of people in the
room and I took notes of it at the time, and here they are
because I thought I would use them at the press conference.
Question: I find it rather strange that... ( inaudible)..
Prime Minister:
I hope no-ones suggests that that was a Dorothy Dix question
because it wasn't.' Look, I find it very odd indeed because I
have been here before, I have had a joint press conference
on earlier occasions and Bruce Goodluck was present on
that earlier occasion and. Michael Hodgman also was,' Ithink.
Mr Lowe expresses these views about the policies we have
introduced in relation to the State of Tasmania but then on
other occasions for purposes that plainly served his election
bill as he believed, he tried to say how terrible the policies
of the Commonwealth were in relation to Tasmania.
But the real answer to Mr Lowe's charges following that Premiers'
conference come out of the State budget itself because State
government 6xpenditure has increased significantly more than
Commonwealth government expenditure. Where is the restraint in
relation to that? If our budget had anything like the impact
on this State that he claimed it was going to have, you would
have thought that he would be really scrabbling to get an
increase in expenditure of 3 or 4 percent. One would have thought
that he would have had to had the most horrific increases in
State charges and State taxes but that hasn' t occured. He has
had an increase in expenditure of 10.. 8% as I am advised, and
in some areas expenditure has gone up very greatly. There has
some taxation relief,. lower land tax rate, estate's passing
to children free from the State duties from January 1, and
all of that belies the harshness of our treatment of Tasmania.
It was in many ways, I would have thought, a fairly benign budget
but it was one in which the State's growth of expenditure was
significantly greater than the Commonwealth's growth of expenditure.
That demonstrates very plainly that overall I have been
more than fair in my dealings with the State of Tasmania, and
I think that the State budget is a total repudiation of the campaign
which Mr Lowe: initiated for his earlier election.
Question: Given the fact, then, that the State's governments seem to vary
on how the Federal government has treated Tasmania, why do you
then feel today that you have had useful discussions with Mr Lowe?
He might turn around and say something quite opposite the next day?
Prime Minister:
I suppose it is my charitable nature. I always hope that what is
said in these sorts of discussions will prevail for a little while.
12
Question: ( inaudible)
Prime Minister:
Yes, there was a useful discussion. What Mr Lowe-and Mr Batt
said about the Callaghan report and our implementation of those
policies, what they said about the Freight Equalisation scheme,
I think these things were useful. On a range of other matters
where there was an exchange of view I mentioned the question
Of airfares, I have mentioned the Callaghan report. There was
some discussion but it was not substa ntial in relation to what
happens after the Empress of Australia. He expressed appreciation
of the second Hobart bridge. He wanted some consultation between
his * officials and ours on public houses in Tasmania. We are
happy to have our officials come down and enter into those
discussions and Ray Groom will be organising that and will be
reporting to me and to the Commonwealth after the discussions
have taken place. There was some discussion about the restoration
of Port Arthur, international fishery negotiations and the
point of view of Tasmania was taken into account but it was
recognised that those negotiations are proceeding, they should
be allowed to go through the normal processes. Then there was
question of coastal surveillance and Peter Nixon pointed out
that there had been some delay in the total overall approach
because of the Commonwealth desire to use Australian designed
and built aircraft, the Nomad. Now, I think that exchange of
views on these particular matters was useful. I think it is
useful to try and establish a good working relationship, which
as Mr Lowe readily conceded, in relation to the
Callaghan report, he has with Kevin Newman.
Question:
Are you suggesting that in none of those issues the State
was at all critical of the Federal. Government?
Prime Minister:
It was not critical today, no. I'm not saying they have been
asking for more, here or there. But, the whole tenor of the
discussions was one of appreciation.
Question: ( inaudible)
Prime Minister:.
No, cabinet has not looked at that. There are always interesting
suggestions coming out of the State of Queensland.