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PRESS OFFICE TRANSCRIPT WEDNESDAY 11 JULY 1979
PRIME MINISTER INTERVIEWED BY REV. NEIL ADCOCK,
RADIO STATION 6PR, PERTH
Adcock On Nightline I'm happy to be talking by ' phone in Canberra
with the Prime Minister of Australia, the Rt. Hon. Malcolm Fraser.
Mr. Fraser, welcome to 6PR and thank you for your willingness
to talk to me.
Prime Minister
Thank you very much.
Adco ck
People I talk to in Perth are very deeply concerned, as I'm sure
they are all over Australia, about what they see as the present
fragmentation of this nation. What are you and your Government
willing to do to bring us together again?
Prime Minister
Well, I'm also concerned. I don't believe the fragmentation
is as great as people often see but in industrial matters it's
very often more evident than in other areas. There have been
problems in Western Australia. There have been problems in
Telecom, especially in the Sydney area right at this very
moment. One of the things that we've got to do is to understand
that in many things we need to put Australia first and our
own particular or individual interests second or third. In the
industrial arena if we could all only understand that we have
established an arbitration system, a system of independent
tribunals designed to determine the merits of cases between
employees and employers, that we don't need industrial dispruption,
bans and limitations to enable that system to work, that if we
allow the arbitration processes to work then the public are not
going to be inconvenienced. We are not going to have
confrontation as essential services dry up and fail, then that
in itself would be making an enormous contribution. I was
very disappointed last Friday when we appealed to the ACTU to put
its weight and to try to get its affiliates to support the
general system of conciliation and arbitration. We weren't
putting it to them that they should support any on side in that,
merely that they should support the system and urge their trade
union affiliates to do so and leave strikes and bans aside.
I was very disappointed indeed that Mr. Hawke and the ACTU
executives who were with him were not prepared to join in
that particular appeal.
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Adcoc k
Do you believe that the time has come in Australia for
people at top level of Government, trade union and management
maybe to get away from the eyes of the media, the general
publicity, to do mayble what was done by President Carter
with Begin and Sadat, to talk together in the hope that
there can be some sort of personal conciliation.
Prime* Minister
I think that's certainly a good thing. Now, again, during
the proposed national stoppage and the possible blockade of
Western Australia with the members of the ACTU, Peter Nolan
and myself and other members of his organisation and my
Cabinet, we were able to discuss that matter for several hours,
to be in communication with Des O'Neil in Perth and also
with the TLC representatives and a major national stoppage or
a blockade of Western Australia was averted as I believe, by
sensible discussion. I think that was an example of the way
we ought to go about our business.
Adcoc k
Well do you believe that this sort of thing can happen again
or should happen again?
Prime Minister-
I think it-should happen again. We hoped the process would work
in what we thought was, in a sense, an appeal to motherhood,
in support for the arbitration system. That didn't work
last Friday.
Adco ck
Thank you. Now, on another track, why is it apparently
inevitable that high unemployment should be the price that
Australia is paying to achieve the commendable goal of
containing inflation?
Prime Minister
It is not really the price of it. The high unemployment we now have
is the price we are paying for high inflation in earlier years
and we need to remember what happened. Wages went up too much,
Government expenditure went up too much, there was a rapid
inflation that went up to 19 percent in one half year. and,
against that background, Australian manufacturers were just
not able to sell their goods overseas. They were also
prejudiced in delivering overseas because of strikes which meant_
they couldn't deliver on time so they lsot overseas markets.
But they also lost many domestic markets because Australian goods
became too high priced compared to prices from countries
overseas, which had done a better job in controlling inflation.
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Prime Minister ( continued)
If a factory in Perth can't sell its goods it plainly can't
employ. So to overcome that situation we've had to get back
to re-establishing the competitive basis of Australian industry
so that we get a better share of the local market and get back
into exports. Now that's starting to happen. Australian
manufacturers are getting out into export markets in a very
imaginative way and they're getting a much better share of
the local market, but the process unfortunately takes a
considerable time to work its way through.
Adcock And when do you-anticipate it will have basically worked
its way through?
Prime Minister
Well', to get back to the kind of employment levels we had
seven or eight years ago might be very difficult indeed. Wage
levels have gone up so much that many jobs have disappeared.
You know, you get automatic petrol pumps and self-help
petrol pumps, less jobs there for young people who might
sometimes find it hard to get jobs that take many particular
talents or qualifications.
Adcock On the development of technology, this leads me into the next
question because it appears to me that the galloping effects
of technology have largely caught us in Australia unprepared.
Is Australia facing up realistically to the predictable social
effects of new technology, of automation and the resultant
increased leisure time, say in the next ten years?
Prime Minister
We sometimes need better mechanisms of consultation between
management and labour on the introduction of new technology but
what we also need to know very clearly is that without new
technology unemployment will rise. New technology is one of
the things that again makes it possible for Australian industry
to compete. If something can be produced more cheaply as a
result of new technology, well then there's the chance for
the Australian firm to be producing more of it. You can be
very certain that countries overseas will be using the new
technology so if we don't we get left behind. We've got no
option in that.
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Adcock I suppose what I'm really saying is that, you know, have
again the leaders of the nation from the various disciplines
sort of sat down and worked out a policy whereby it will
not create unnecessary unemployment but the new technology
can be absorbed and used constructively for the benefit
of the nation.
Prime Minister
I think so, yes. But it varies industry by industry. Some
industries are much better at consultation than others. and,
you know, very often the introduction of new technology in
fact opens up more jobs because you find industry doing new
things and additional things, supplying additional
commodities which people are going to want, all things which
have only become possible because of new techniques and new
technology. So what we need to do is to embrace new
technology and use it to Australia's advantage. The Government
has had surveys of this particular matter long before there
was general public concern in Australia. We had expressed
our own concern by iniating significant investigations and
examinations of technology, its implications for Australia,
what we ought to be doing about That was going
back a couple of years so there are complex questions. But
one of the most important things is to make sure that more
people understand the implications. I think that so often
it is the unknown that frightens people.
Adcock Mr. Prime Minister, I would like to ask you a question not
related to the whole oil issue, but if more oil reserves
were discovered in Australia would it be necessary then to lift
our prices to world parity and why?
Prime* Minister
I believe we ought to, yes. The main reason is that we want
industry and individuals to make rational economic decisions
about the energy they use. That means we want an economic
price for oil, the gas, the coal and then people will make
the appropriate choices. If we keep oil down to artificially
low levels, then more industries will stay on oil, more
individuals will use oil, less people will go to natural
gas-fired motor cars than to petrol. That means that a
finite resource will be used up more quickly than it should be.
One of the great tragedies in the United States is that it
uses more oil than any other nation, it uses vast quantities
and the price is so low that they use much more than
their fair share of, again, a finite resource. It ought to be
understood.-also that most European countries put much higher
taxes on oil than we do, again to try and make sure that there
are rational and sensible economic decisions made about
the use of energy.: Because their taxes on oil are higher,
their actual fuel prices will be anything up to double ours.
I'm not suggesting~ we should do that but I do believe we need
to stay basically with world parity pricing.
Adcock Well, are you suggesting it's more a conservation measure
than an economic measure?
Prime Minister
Well, it's a conservation measure, but we're only going to
get that conservation measure if industry makes rational
decisions about the source of energy they are going to use.
Adcock Now can I ask you a question about one issue that's on here
in the West? Gold is running at a record price. Is it ' likely
that your Government will take any initiatives or give any
incentive to get the Golden Mile operation again in Kalgoorlie?
Prime Minister-
Well again, this is very much a function of price and if more
mines could open up as a result of the cuirrent price nothing
would please us more.
Adcoc k
You'll be very happy to know that the arena that you opened,
the gift of the Federal Government for Western Australia's
150th year, the hockey stadium here in Perth, is being-. used
very effectively and very thoroughly. Are you involved
in any other event in the 150th celebration coming to Perth
before the end of the year?
Prime* Minister
I hope I'll be o ver in Perth towards the end of the year.
I'll be over in twoor three weeks time for a particular function
but it's not specifically related to the Centenerary and I
hope very much to be there towards the end of the year.
Adcock Right. Thanks very much for talking to us and will it be
possible for me to talk to you again maybe about once a month
so that you can keep us up to date here in Perth with the things
that are happening in Canberra?
Prime' Minister-
Yes. I'd be very happy to do that, very happy indeed.
* Adcock
Mr. Fraser, thank you very much for talking to us on 6PR tonight.
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