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PRESS OFFICE TRANSCRIPT 3 MAY 1979
PRIME MINISTER ON TALK-BACK PROGRA DIE
RADIO STATION 6VA, ALBANY, WVESTERN AUSTRALIA
Question For several days now we have been promising you the opportunity
of talking directly to the nation's leader, the Rt. Honourable
the Prime Minister, Malcolm Fraser. That moment has arrived.
Our Prime Minister is with us in the studios right at this
moment. Mr. Prime Minister, you may not be aware of it but this
is an important occasion for us here at 6VA and our listeners
so our welcome to you is a most sincere one. Welcome and it
is great to have you here in Albany.
Prime Minister
Thank you very much. It's very good to be here.
Question Can I ask you first of all, is this the first time you have
been to Albany or were you here as a Minister some years ago?
Prime Minister
I was here as a Minister for Education some years ago. I think
also once before that. It was quite a long while ago and I have
been looking forward to coming back very much.
Question I think the last time Albany was visited by a Prime Minister
wvas on the occasion of-the unveiling of the Desert Mount
( inaud) Memorial; the late Sir Robert Menzies was here.
Do you recall that visit by Sir Robert?
Prime Minister
I wasn't here, but I think I recall the occasion. There was a
good deal of debate where this memorial was to be placed I think,
wasn't there, in earlier times?
Question Yes Prime Minister
I was in the Parliament at the time of course and in the end
I think the memorial was placed in a very fitting place.
Question That brings us to Anzac Day of course, tomorrow. What are your
own personal feelings about Anzac Day. It is the 64th anniversary.
Should Australians be remembering or should we be forgetting? / 2
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Prime Minister
No, we ought to be remembering. One of the things
ANZACS fought for and people in world wars and other wars
have fought for I think is I wasn't in the War, I was a kid
during the last World War I think that most people would
be saying ' I hope this doesn't have to happen again, I hope
my sons won't be involved as I have been involved' and I think
that would be the kind of thought in a serviceman's mind.
I believe that we ought to remember. We ought to remember
the debt that we owe those who have fought for freedom and
liberty in Australia which is really fighting for the right
of people to bring up their families in their own way and
that is really what it is all about. We ought to remember on
this one day a year, what many people did valiantly and
I think we ought to try and commit ourselves a bit harder to
work* to make sure that the same sorts of circumstances
and need doesn't arise again.
CALLER I am Peter Lomas and I am President of the Albany Voluntary
Community Group, which has some 32 affiliated groups in the
local area of membership and we recently conducted a survey
as to the need for a family planning clinic in this town,
to service the wide area of the great southern. This survey
has shown that there is a real need and demand for such a
facility. In fact these figures were 11 to 1 in favour of
having one. We-have been told by t * he Perth-based Family
Planning Association, who receive a Commonwealth funding for
this purpose, that such funds for Albany are simply not
available. As such a project is needed here, and as we would
be serving such a large geographical area, have you, sir, any
suggestions as to where we may get Government help in this
matter and if not, could you please explain how this policy
fits in with the Government's policy of decentralisation?
Prime Minister
I think there are two or three things there and let me try
and deal with it separately. We all know that there has been
difficulty in Government expenditure over the last two or three
years because whatever we spend we have to take from you
and many thousands of others like you, in taxes. Governments
haven't got anything of their own, or politicians certainly
haven't, when they are making political promises to spend.
They are really saying we are gping to spend something that we
have to take from the people of Albany, the people of Perth,
the people of Melbourne and Sydney. There has been a need for
restraint in expenditure... There has been a great desire for
lower taxes. I think this has also been necessary for the
general health of the economy in Australia. Family planning
is important and I am interested to know the results of the
survey that you've undertaken. What I would like to do is to
see how the priorities are set in Western Australia. I will talk
to Peter Drummond, who is in the studio with me at the moment,
about this and what I would like to do perhaps is to be able
to get your name and address get that written down so that
either I or Peter Drummond can write to you a little later
about it. / 3
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CALLER I wish to pass on my congratulations in Western Australia.
We follow as much as we cani what you are doing on the other
part of the continent. We know that you have some very
difficult situations to get through and we appreciate some
of what you are doing. What I have to ask is this: you
remember the census that you had in July 1976 on population
and housing. Now, I have nothing against you people, but as
it happened, because of certain happenings, I refused to answer
a single word in the census. Now, sir, according to law
anyone that has not completed the census are supposed to
be prosecuted and fined. Here is 1979 now and I am still
awaiting a summons as to the reason why I have not filled in
the paper. As I say, I have nothing against your party
but ( inaudible) in this?
Prime Minister
Can I ask you a question, do you want a summons?
CALLER
The thing is this for the sake of population, put it that
way all the better, as far as I go. But of course, again,
there must be others who have failed to fill in their forms
and if I am pulled over the coals then the others should also.
But I am certainly looking forward, if it comes to that, to
ask the reason as to why I deliberately failed to
I have said before, congratulations in what you are doing, but
there is a certain, if I may use the word, strategy in the
refusal of what I did.
Prime Minister
I would say two things; I would like to thank you very much
for what you have said about the Government and what the
Government is trying to do. In relation to the census I think
there has been a feeling that the Bureau of Statistics has
been asking more and more questions, going more and more into
matters which some people have regarded as personal and private
to them. I think there has been an objection to that.
In past censuses the Government has looked at the form and it
has ultimately approved it. But what we have determined in
relation to the next census is that there should be public
communication, public discussion, about the nature of the
questions and the sorts of questions so that they can be
a community input into the census and therefore maybe a better
understanding of the purposes that-the census is meant to fulfill.
I don't know if that gets to the cause of your particular...
CALLER
Not at all. I heartily agree with the census of population, 3
housing, Australia. I heartily agree with that. As I say,
there is a certain reason I wanted to know why I hadn't been
pulled over the coals. 4
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Prime Minister
I'd have to make some enquiries about that so I would need
you name and address, again, and I could try and find out why
that hasn't happened. Again, either I or Peter Drummond could
let you know.
CALLER I have experience in both parts of the world in various
miatters... Birthday calls on programme.
CALLER First of all Mr. Prime Minister,, welcome to Albany and I hope
you have a very pleasant stay here. I am a Member of the
Samaratin Telephone Service in this area and I also speak
on behalf of the Albany Voluntary Community Group.
I know your interest in what I am going to have to say.
Our work makes us increasingly aware of the very real need
for a Government funded and operated accommodation centre,
both short and long term, for people with emotional disorders.
That ranges through alcoholics, drug addicts, potential
suicides, women in need of a refuge and homeless youngsters.
Funds have been allocated in the past for any of these project
-have rarely flowed beyond -the metropolitan area. Albany is
a large community with a wide landward area and we should nolonger
have to say to a caller ' you must go 250 miles for
the accomodation and treatment you need'.~ Can you make some
comments on that or how we can possibly get some action in
this area.
Prime Minister
I think two things; we do try and get services out into
remote areas.. Albany is not really a remote area in the sense
that many parts of Western Australia are remote, but we do try
and get the best possible services available over major
decentralised areas throughout Australia. It depends on, I
suppose, demand, and again how much money we've got to spend
as to how far you can go with that. Again, I would like to do
what I indicated in relation to an earlier question. I will
discuss this with Peter Drummnond who is in the studio with me.
We will make some inquiries as to how priorities are set in
Western Australia and either Peter or myself will drop you a
note about it a little later on. But when I have said this
on a couple of occasions.,. I hope the.. radio station is taking
the names.
Question It seems that there are a number of people who have items of
concern, but I'm wondering just how a man in your position,
how aware can you be of the difficulties facing a small town,
or a relatively small town such as our. Does it ever come
across your table that there are a lot of small towns in
this country and the problems that they have.
Prime Minister
It does every day of the week because I represent an
electorate, Wannon; it is a country electorate in
Western Victoria. I won it from the Labor Party and they had
held it for the previous 13 years and through most of its
history in Federal life. Whether it is a safe Liberal seat
now or not I don't know, but I have held it for the last
24 or 25 years. There are towns there of 200 or 300. Some
towns of 20 or 30, 10,9000, 15,000, 20,000, 25,000. I still
regard my job as a local representative, as in a sense, a
first duty in politics. I advertise that I am going to be
in Hamilton at 9: 00 o'clock in the morning and people with their
problems come along and see me, whatever they might be.
I have a very large electoral correspondence. In this way,
quite apart from other occasions coming to. Albany, Bunbury
earlier today people tell you what their problems are, their
concerns are, their fears are. In these ways you do keep in
touch. Maybe if that doesn't make you conscious of the
concerns of people then the representations of Members like
Peter Drummond certainly does because they come along and say
" look, my people are worried this, or concerned about that".
The image of politicians shut away in Canberra,' not knowing
what goes on, I don't really think is valid in many cases
because we are out and about. A week doesn't pass when I'm
not in some part of Australia speaking to some real Australians.
CALLER Ken Bruce. One query I have. We had this I forget what
you call it cost of living index rise. This, I presume,
accounts for the cost of living in the previous six months.
Prime Minister
Three months. It comes out every quarter.
CALLER Every quarter, yes. That's right. Well how come, how does it
arise that we then get price rises to compensate for the wage
increase? Prime Minister
This is the old chicken and the eg-g argument. What comes first.
If wages go up too much prices plainly have to go up. Raw
material prices can go up. Over the last year beef prices
have plainly gone up. That affects the price of meat in the
supermarkets. It does affect a lot of manufactured products,
food processed products. The price of oil has gone up because
we had to move to a world parity pricing for oil and that flows
through into a number of areas in different industries.
transport and power industries in some areas. What we have
is a Prices Justification Tribunal that does watch prices in
that area and makes recommendations. There are some amendments
to the Act which I think will make the Tribunal more effective
and more flexible and it will be getting a reference to cover
all those areas affected or that have an impact on the Consumer
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Prime Minister ( continued)
Price Index. In other words, that are important to people
in their daily living. In many senses the Prices Tribunal
is the umpire for the areas which it has under reference,
just as the Arbitration Commission is the umpire in the wages
area. These things need to be kept in balance. I am just
as much opposed to companies putting up prices too much as I
am opposed to trade unionists who sometimes demand too much
in a wage increase, because both are damaging to the economy.
CALLER I am inclined to agree with that, but it seems as though if we
put up the wages sort of thing to compensate for the previous
price rise in materials, etc. and then as soon as the wages go
up again they turn around and put them up again to compensate
for the wages, which doesn't seem
Prime Minister
Thi~ s is where it all ought to stop, and if we could go for a
year with no wage increases...
CALLER And no price increases
Prime Minister
And to the maximum extent possible no price-increases, we would
knock the biggest hole in inflation that there ever was.
But you can't impose I think by some statute or some law.
The Federal Parliament hasn't the power anyway. But countries
where the Governments do have the constitutional power to do
that it hasn't really worked. They might have held things down
for a while but it's a bit like a kettle on a gas ring. You
can keep the lid on it for a while but if it is boiling away
the pressure builds up and at the end of the time countries
that have tried that sort of statutory price control have found
that it has been impossible to maintain and after the controls
were off the price increases were very great. One of the things
that is most important in this for all of us is restraint by
all of us. Somebody said that if we all got paid according to
our own judgement of what we are worth, we would send the country
bankrupt. So we all have to take a bit less than maybe we think
we ought to get.
CALLER I rang to say I am very proud to see that you are here
and that if a lot of people in the Albany areas were to have
so much confidence in you and Mr. Drummond, Mr. Knight and our
local representative, I think that this world would be a lot
better to deal with.
Prime Minister
I am delighted that you rang. So often people ring up and they
throw some bricks, or whatever, or try to, it's very nice for
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Prime Minister ( continued)
somebody who has some kind thoughts to express to ring up.
CALLER Mr. Prime Minister, if they throw bricks at you I would be
your bodyguard sir.
Prime Minister
Sometimes I catch them and throw them back.
CALLER Mr. Knight and the rest of our representatives. It is
great to have you here, sir and I hope that everybody will
listen to you and try to get us where you are trying to head.
Prime Minister
The thing I like most about what you said is the respect
you obviously have for your local State representatives and
also for Peter Drummond, who does a very great job in Canberra,
because in one sense even if you don't think much of me so long
as you think a lot of Peter Drummond as a local representative
that is really the important thing. He is the guy that I
hope people are going to go on voting for.
CALLER I think Mr. Drummond would know me. I'm very very proud to
know him, you sir, and our local representative.
Question I don't know. Talking about some people throwing stones, I
suppose, and I am surprised that somebody hasn't already thrown
this stone regarding the whaling issue. I guess it's up to
me,, Mr. Prime Minister, to ask you for your own personal
appraisal of what the cessation of whaling in Australia has done
for the nation. Has it been worth the price that Albany has paid.
Prime Minister
The Government's decision in relation to the Frost Inquiry was
in one sense made easier by the earlier economic decision of
Cheynes Beach Whaling to shut down. I know the companies tried
to-say that the-very fact that an inquiry was-being held made
it difficult for it to market its product. I find that a
little difficult to accept. I don't think that's valid. If
it was the Inquiry I think they would have kept going and waited
until the inquiry had reported and maybe waited until the
Government was making a decision about it. But because the
company had just down, as we believe for economic reasons,
not related to the inquiry, when we came to make decisions on
the Frost Report itself. It was in fact a much easier decision
than it would otherwise have been, simply because the activity
had ceased so far as Australia is concerned. / 8
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Question H-ave you had that feedback internationally, from other
countries. Prime Minister
We've had a feedback from a large number of people around the
world. I was speaking with Sir Peter Scott, who is I don't
know if you know of the World Wildlife Fund but it is probably
the most responsible conservation body worldwide. It doesn't
politicise. It doesn't get out and play politics with
environmental issues. It is now established in Australia and
has been operating here over the last, or seeking to get
established, over the last two years. It's got a very eminent
group of people in charge of it. Peter Scott comes out from
time to time from Britian to keep in touch, because it is a
worldwide organisation. I know, in that environment, there is
a very great respect and hope for the decision that Australia
has in fact taken. We haven't had any objections on economic
grounds from other countries, from those that are continuing
to operate in whaling. Indeed, I would believe that they are
already starting to make moves towards the general worldwide
phasing out of whaling and in the international environment
Australia's voice Iwill now be directed to that end. These
things are very difficult when there is an economic activity
that has been important to a country community. We would have
been faced with very difficult decis ions if the whaling company
had still be operating. But it hadn't and on our judgement of
the facts it has stopped for genuine economic reasons, quite
unrelated to the inquiry itself.
Question Can I ask how well-informed you were at the time that the
inquiry was sitting in Albany. Were you personally aware of
the situation as it was developing day by day?
Prime Minister
No, not in front of the inquiry. You have to get people to do
a job, then you look at their report. I am afraid that with
all the things that have to come over my desk, I can't keep
in daily touch with the actual conduct of a particular
inquiry, although if there are major or significant problems with
the way a particular tribunal inquiry is operating, that gets
reported and you soon hear about that.
Question-I should have asked you this question right at the beginning
because I think a lot of people in the town and the area
generally are feeling that perhaps when the Prime Minister comes
to Albany he might have some glad tidings for us, some good news.
Do you have any such good news for us sir? 9
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Prime Minister
I think there is good news, but it is not in the form of
I have come here like Father Christmas. Australia is looking
up, the future is looking much brighter. The rural community
is happier I think than it has been for a long while. Beef and
sheep and wheat have all had a good year. From a look at
the countryside flying in it has rained so there has been
an autumn break around here. I really do believe that with
inflation down and costs much more under control, with the
way we have worked over the last three years to develop and
protect markets for beef and rural products in the United
States and Japan, and I think we will even have some limited
success into Europe, I think the future is much more assured.
In 1974 when beef prices really crashed, down to disaster
levels and they stayed very low since except-for the last year,
we built up to 100,000 tonnes into Japan and then they suddenly
said no beef this year. Obviously that was disaster news for
Australian producers in large parts of Australia. With the
trade negotations and the trade agreements that we will have
I think our markets are going to be secured in a way that they
haven't ever been for Australia's agricultural exports. I am
not going to say that farmers have never had it so good, because
somebody else said that once and it wasn't really so. But I do
think it is looking up. I think we have a right to expect,
provided the seasons are reasonably kind, that the next year
or so are going to enable farmers to re-build their reserves
and assets a bit. That's not just farmers you are talking about
when you are saying that, because it obviously has an impact
on country towns, farmers are buying more equipment, they are
repairing their properties, they are buying new machinery.
So it has impact on country towns and on the industries that
service the rural community. If I am bringing any sort of a
message to Albany, it's one of confidence; confidence in this
part of a very very great State and enormous confidence in
the 1980s and in what Australia can achieve.
CALLER I have a question for the Prime Minister. I was going to ask
whether he has any thoughts about youth unemployment. The
high. level of the young people leaving ( inaudible) lack of
jobs. Prime Minister
Yes I have. This is a difficult problem for a -number of young
people. I think we need to understand that it is not the whole
group that is in difficulty, it is maybe 10% or 12% of a
particular age group, people that perhaps haven't done so well
at school, might be a bit diffident, might be a bit uncertain
of themselves. The training programmes that we have developed
are designed to try and assist such people, to give them an
opportunity to get into work. Something over 400,000 people,
many of them young people, have been helped by the Government's
training programmes over the last two to three years. I also
believe that for that section of each age group that does find
it difficult to get work that schools can pay more attention
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Prime Minister ( continued)
in their own training because so often schools pay a lot of
attention to those that are academically bright, that are going
to go on to universities and colleges and this is good for
the schools reputation we've got such a percentate of our
kids going to university or college and they are all doing
well, but what about the ones that don't go to university or
college that want a different kind of future, that want to
go ' into a apprenticeship or a trade or something else. I am
not at all sure that in recent times our school system hasn't
concentrated too much on the academic qualifications and hasn't
sought to draw out and build a confidence in kids that mightn't
be so bright academically but might have many other talents
which are quite as valuable but they are different talents.
What I am saying is there is a problem. I think many people
can contribute to trying to solve it, but the better economic
future which we are now facing is also of course going to make
sure that more jobs are available. The problems aren't all
going to disappear overnight. I don't want to suggest that
because there are so many that are tending to disappear. You
used to have people look after petrol bowsers. Now they tend
to be automatic or self-serve. So a job disappears. That I
think just means that we've got to pay more attention at school
and after school and to the transition into work to try and
help people that are finding it a bit difficult.
000---S