JOINT PRESS CONFERENCE
GIVEN BY THE AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER, MR. E. G. WHITLAM
AND PRIME MINISTER OF THE NETHERLANDS, MR. J. M. DEN UYL,
IN THE HAGUE, 6 JANUARY 1975
Well, Ladies and Gentlemen, our Australian friends are very
short of time, therefore we will immediately start and make your
questions very short.
DEN UYL: Well only a very few introductory remarks as to have
as much time as possible for Mr. Whitlam and your questions. Let
me say how very glad we are to have the opportunity to have this
exchange of thoughts. We dealt with the position of Australia
in the world, the position of Holland in the European community
the way Australia looks upon the European community and the role
of Holland in it, questions of co-operation in development aid
and in the relation, of course, thepolicies towards Indonesia.
And besides that we dealt with a number of bilateral questions.
Well, I would think that is enought introduction and I would
like Mr. Whitlam to put forward a few introductory remarks.
WHITLAM: You will see from what the Prime Minister has said
the range of matters which we discussed. It has been a very
fruitful weekend and the Prime Minister, his wife too, may I
say, and his Ministers and his officials have spent very many
hours witht he Australian party. It has been very easy for us to
exchange views because our countries are exceptionally similar.
Sure we are remote in geography, we are disparate in size, but we
have the same population we have the same average income, we
are among the most highly industrialisedcountries in the world,
we are among the largest trading countries in the world and of
course the Governments are fraternal ones. Six years ago I
was in the Netherlands and met Mr. Den Uyl for the first time
and we since have become Prime Minister at the same time.
DEN UYL: I became so just a few months after the elections.
WHITLAM: Yourelection system is confusing to other people and
ours is confusing to other people. Your election took place
some days before ours in 1972, but it took some months to
achieve a decision as to who was to be Prime Minister.
Last May we had an election and it was three months before we
knew who were to be the members of the Parliament. So it is
indicative of the stress under which all western societies,
even those with the benefit of social democrat Governments,
Labour these days. It has been a very fruitful weekend and
since the Netherlands makes a quite exceptionally disproportionate
contribution to the EEC, the OECD, to International bodies in
general. It has been valuable to us not only for the understanding
of the world as a whole and particularly of the
countries with which we compare ourselves. So thank you very
much for what you have done in the party, in the Government,
among officials, over Friday, Saturday, Sunday and now Monday.
QUESTIONE Were any decisions taken during the negotiations
during the weekend?
DEN UYL: You might not call them decisions, because we did not
have a particular agenda on which to negotiate but we made
some appointments on wider consultations, on migration problems,
on co-operation and development fields, on questions of uranium,
and the ultracentrifuge installationswe have in Holland
just appointments for wide a prolonged consultations.
QUESTIONS: Mr. Prime Minister, there is a quite big rumour
that there is a big contract for Australia selling uranium to
either the EEC. ( Sic). Whtat is true about this rumour and is
Holland interested in uranium or what?
WHITLAM: As I understand this situation the EEC cannot
collectively enter in to contracts concerning uranium. Obviously
the Australians will be discussing the general situation of
uranium in each of the EEC countries they visit and we will be
visiting half a dozen of them. Any specific contracts have to
be made with individual countries as things stand at the
moment. Nevertheless the development of Australia's vert great
uranium resources it is believed we posses one-fifth of the
proven uranium resources in the world the development of these
is a matter of international concern and negotiation because
Australia does not have the technology and Australia by herself
does not have the capital to develop these resources as far as
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they have to be developed and as far as we would like them to
be developed in Australia. The Netherlands is associated with
Britain and West Germany I have already visited Britain and I
shall be visiting West Germany in one particular process
for enriching uranium. Very naturally Australia and Japan,
which are conducting a feasibility study into the question of
enriching Australia's uranium, will be interested in the
attitude of these three countries which have this particular
process. QUESTION: There were no appointments made about selling uranium
to the Netherlands?
WHITLAM: There were no contracts mabe, no, no, no.
QUESTION: Prime Minister was there any specific discussion on
provision of technology?
WHITLAM: The provision of technology was very obviously one
of the matters discussed.
QUESTION: Mr. Prime Minister we understand that you discussed
the need for Great Britain to stay in the Common Market. Can
you elaborate on that in any way please?
WHITLAM: I do not want to give the impression that I would be
telling the British what they should do and I am sure my
colleague does not wish to give that impression either. But
nevertheless it is relevant for Australia to express her attitude
about Britain's membership of the community since traditionally
Britain was Australia's biggest trading partner. She is by no
means Australia's biggest trading partner now. We look at
questions of trade these days in terms of the Community and the
Community is the largest trading partner of Australia now. I
can say that there is no possible advantage, in the Australian
Government's view, in Britain leaving -the Community. Previous
Australian Governments may have given that impression. I fear
they did give that impression not only in Britain when the
Conservatives and Labor has sought to join the Community,
but they also gave that impression among the six who then
constituted the Community. They gave the impression that
Australia resented Britain joining the Community and they gave
the impression that they wanted to frustrate any such accession
by Britain and now my Government takes no such attitude and
certainly should leave no such impreesion. There is in our
view no possible advantage to Australia in Britain leaving
the Community. I suppose I can go further and say that these
days so many things depend on international co-operation.
It is absurd for the west to be so divided as it is. We are
in our social and economic and political habits in Australia,
a western country, and we believe it strengthens our sort of
societies, the mixed economies the hitherto affluent countries
of the world, the countries which trade and manufacture for
them to work together. Accordingly, I suppose, I hope it is not
regarded as too muck out of place that we believe that the
west in general will be much stronger, happier, more effective
if it works together. And that includes Britain working with
her neighbours on the continent.
DEN UYL: May I add one word to what Mr Whitlam said about
Britain. It was rather peculiar to discover that I would think
that there are hardly any other countries inthe world that
would be so eager to see Britain within the European Community
than Australia and the Netherland. That was our experience of
discussing these affairs.
QUESTION: Could I reverse that question in other words would
you that Australia might be worse off if Britain were to
leave the Common Market?
WHITLAM: I do not want to speculate on whether Britain will
leave the Common Market. I cannot tell what would happen if she
did. QUESTION: Mr. Prime Minister, changing the subject somewhat, we
are in a part of the world which particularly felt the effects
of the Arab oil embargo and which has felt the effects of the
increase in oil prices. Can you spell out here Australia's
attitude to American initiatives for an oil-sharing scheme and
also can you tell us now whether Australia will attend the
conference of consuming nations which America proposes?
WHITLAM: Well no arrangements have been made yet. Obviously
I have discussed in each of the European countries I visited this
general question, that is, the possibility of disrupting the
whole infra-structure upon which trading countries have relied
up till now and the access to resources. Australia's situation
is not entirely the same as that of western Europe. Quite
obviously that must be the case because we do have ample energy
resources ourselves in general and we are situated on the other
side of the oil-rich lands.
QUESTION: Do you have any other...
WHITLAM: No I will not elaborate at this stage.
QUESTION: Mr. Prime Minister, can I ask a question on
immigration? I was tlaking to Dr. Moss Cass, Minister for the
Environment and Conservation. He said zero population was for
the time being the policy of Australia because that would give
an example on how to keep population down on the planet,
while Mr. Tom Uren said the one percent population increase
was his policy, but the one percent population increase, as the
average is 1.9, cancels out the 0.8 percent increase in immigration.
Has any commitment been made during your visit? Did you discuss
the question or can you give any information on the immigration
policy as far as the Dutch...
WHITLAM: I will not respond to your kind references to my
colleagues. My practice is not to comment in terms of what
other people are reported or thought to have said. So I
therefore overlook what you said them. You will accept that I hope
with good grace. Now on the question of immigration that is,
you asking my views. Well, that is fair enough. There has been
a diminution in migration from western Europe since the 1950' s.
There have been for very many years now migrants from, say the
Netherlands to Australia. There are about 160,000 people in
Australia who migrated from the Netherlands, but most of them
came in earlier years. With increasing prosperity and security
in western Europe we have found that the number of people from
the Netherlands and other western European countries has declined.
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Most of the migrants to Australia now come from Southern
Europe from Italy, and Malta, Yugoslavia, Greece, Cyprus.
There has been a reduction in the target of migrants which the
Australian Government has sought. The immediate reason for
that has been the extent of unemployment in Australia. It is
no kindness to the people coming to Australia or the people
who are already there to have people competing for too few
jobs. Also there is probably an overall situation: migrants
particularly in the last ten years or so, have settled in Sydney
and Melbourne which are already growing too much. And
furthermore we were finding the Australia was losing a great
number of migrants becuase Australia's socialservices, health
service, housing facilities, were not as good as those for
instance in western Europe. Our social services can't compete
with those of the Netherlands although they have been improved
immensely in the two years of my Government. And furthermore
we have now made the payment of social services to people who
have earned them in Australia available to them anywhere in the
world. In the Netherlands particularly, we found that there
were a great number of people who had worked and settled very
happily in Australia but as they became older, decided to
retire in the Netherlands because the social services were very
much better. Our prime objective now is to make people who
have migrated Australia or people who from now on migrate to
Australia happy in Australia. And while we are bringing
fewer migrants to Australia the number of migrants who are
staying is very much larger. The net gain is as great as it
used to be and the number of people becoming naturalised as
Australian citizens has almost doubled in the two years that we
have been a government. We are now concerntrating on the
migration of peoplewho have relatives in Australia or who have
skills for which there is an un-fulfilled demand in Australia.
Some figures I notice havebeen quoted in the Netherlands of the
reduced numbers of migrants those figures are an extrapolation
of a small period. They are greatly exaggerated.
QUESTION: Can we expect the Australian dollar to align with one
of the stronger European currencies in th e months ahead?
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WHITLAM: You don't find Heads of Governments commenting on
matters of currency but our alignment is with a basket of
currencies among which of course are some European ones.
Roughly the basket is proportionate to the extent of our trade
with the various countries concerned.
QUESTION: ( Indistinct, but about discussions in Paris)
WHITLAM: Well this obviously should wait until I have spoken
with the French. Our general attitude has been up till now
that it is proper for us to make arrangements for the disposal
of uranium with those countries whic h accept the IAEA
safeguards.
QUESTION: In answer to my earlier question you clearly said
that uranium technology had been discussed, And I asked you
if in fact there had been a specific offer of technology
Could you answer that?
WHITLAM: There was an exchange of views on it. I mentioned
earlier that the Netherlands is involved with two other countries
the West Germans and the British in one particular form of
enrichment. And as you know the Head of the Australian
Department of Minerals and Energy has been visiting the site and
holding discussions himself there.
QUESTION: Mr. Den Uyl, would the Netherlands have reservations
about Japan being tied in with Australia as far as any uranium
deal is concerned because of Japan's constitutional position
whereby it is not allowed to withhold secrets from the public?
DEN UYL: Well, it is one of the points which should be considered
if consultations proceed and we would have to consider any
agreement. But what is happening now is just as Mr. Whitlam
already pointed out, that we are looking at possibilities.
QUESTION: Can I ask a question about dominance in the Indian
Ocean and the change of the strategic centre in the world from
western Europe towards the Indian Coean. You want Diego Garcia
not to be included in the security system of the United States
but by now, as the order becomes more contented, even Dr.
Kissinger is talking about not taking the Arab oil fields.
Does Australia feel that the whole strategic situation is
changing and is tis cabinet adjusting its position?
WHITLAM: There again, do you mind if I take the same attitude
in you conmments on Dr. Kissinger as I took on your comments
about Dr. Cass and Mr. Uren. This may be your technique, it
is not mine, Now you asked me quite legitmately about the
Indian Ocean and about Diego Garcia. It is not the wish of the
Australian Government not of any government in the Indian
Ocean that there should be a confrontation or escalation by the
United States and the Soviet union in the Indian Ocean or
anywhere. But of course, you ask about the Indian Ocean.
We don't want the Indian Ocean, which has been ahppily free of
this super power rivalry, to become the centre of it.
QUESTION: But didnot you in the United States especially talk
about having your own self-realisation and that it does not
only mean not having a confrontation between the Great Powers
byt having a say of your own.
WHITLAM: I have in the United Nationsand my foreign minister
has in the United Nations supported:' the various proposals to
have a zone of peace in the Indian Ocean. That is the attitude
that my Government takes and it is the attitude which all the
countries around and in the Indian Ocean also take.
QUESTION: Obviously a lot of your talks so far have contained
a lot of discussion on the world economy. Could you tell us
how you seee the short and long term future and how you think
European countries are going to fare in the next twelve months?
WHITLAM: The universal feeling in the countries I visited
has been and the reports that they give me of the feeling in the
other countries of western Europe is that of the two great evils
which beset us all to an unexpected and unprecedented extent
inflation and recession-the latter is the greater threat to our
society and our economy. And they are of course doing what they
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can to reduce the inflation but they are more worried immediately
about the recession.
QUESTION: Are they pessimistic?
WHITLAM: They are apprehensive but not pessimistic. Obviously
one hopes that the efforts which we are all making will succeed.
Speaking for myself, I think they will.
QUESTION: Mr. Whitlam, is it the view of the European leaders
you have spoken to so far the President Ford has accepted bad
advice and exaggerated the problem of recession? If so, do
you agree with them or not?
WHITLAM: The general feeling, if I may say so, has been that the
advice that President Ford had been receiving had been contrary
to the feeling which I have just stated as being that of the
western Europeans. But I would not presume to say what adivce
the President is now receiving or taking. There seems to be some
feeling that the advice which he was given and was known to have
been given earlier might not be accepted by him and the Congress.
QUESTION: Mr. Dne Uyl, have you made any specific arrangments
on migration or has there been any proposal?
DEN UYL: Mr. Whitlam pointed out Australian migration policies.
For our part we have stressed the significance that Dutch
emigration to Australia could be continued and we have underlined
that there are some aspects of present Australian migration
policies that stress in particular the entry conditions being
relatives or having special qualifications. There might be some
points which would be worthwhile to discuss further, as
spontaneous emigration always has played a great part in the
Netherlands. But our feeling is that by having consultations
in this field there are real prospects for emigration being as it
was in recent years.
QUESTION: Can you be more specific on this point?
DEN UYL: No.
QUESTION: Mr. Whitlam have you felt like a farmer who took a
holiday and had his barn catch fire because of what has happened
in Darwin and now Tasmania? What is yourfeeling about this
and does it strike you as something to marvel at?
WHITLAM: Well the thought had not occurred to me.
QUESTION: The OECD I believe has decided to jointly remain
open for trade and capital movement. But I believe Australia has
not as yet signed this agreement. I s there any reason why
they have not?
WHITLAM: The general question of investment in being considered
by us and some aspects of it such as double taxation agreements
have been discussed in most of the countries we visited.
QUESTION: Plr. Den Uyl, has any decision been made about uranium?
DEN UYL: You know that in the project for producing the technique
of enrichment for uranium by ultra centrifuge you need to have
uranium to have the process realised commercially so at any time
the three countries which are co-operating in the project will need
uranium. QUESTION: ( indistinct)
DEN UYL: I cannot make statements at this moment on the
amount we need or about the time at which we will need uranium
but the so-called troika, the three countries co-operating in the
project will need uranium, that is quite sure.
QUESTION: A domestic question. Have you been advised what
caused the Hobart tragedy? What action are you prepared to
take?
WHITLAM: I sent a cable to Mr. Reece, the Premier of Tasmania, I
suppose twelve hours ago and I got a, I received a message of
thanks from him. Now you have the text I think. I expect there
will be an inquiry into how such a ludicrous happening took place.
It's beyond my imagination how any competent person could steer
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a ship into the pylons of a bridge, and But I have to restrain myself
because I would expect the person responsible for such an act would
find himself before a criminal jury. There is no possibility
of a Government guarding against mad or incompetent captains
of ships or pilots or aircraft.