UZN* Z EALAID TOUR 1967
PRESS CONF7RENCE HELD BY MR. HOLT
IAT 7ELLI.. JT ONl 33D FEBRUARY, 1967.
Q. Have you thought of any possiole increases Pew Zealand might
make towards the Australian T-Ask Force?
P. imv. Jell you would hardly expect the two Prime inisters to
come togetAer without some discussion occurrin. in relation to
Vietnam, and I think there was a reference to That in the
communique which has been put out. There have ouen su-restions
I gather that my visit here haLd some connection with That and the
size of ew Zealand forces. I make it quite clear that that was
not included in any of the purposes of m visit, nor would I presume
to 4ay to a Kew Zealand overnment what the level of its contriution
oug1nt to be. It is quite capable of resolving that matter for
itself, but I do say, as I recall it in the com: unique that we
continue our support of Vietnam in its defence against agression and
we actively join in the search for a just and peaceful negotiation
or a just an peaceful settlement arising out of a negotiation.
hat would be your vi3ew if the Few Zealand Tovernment were to
propose that the battalion now with the Commonwealth Strategic
dieserve be re-deployed in Vietnam, and has this been mentioned to
you in official conference?
P. M. I would not comment on that matter. It would raise questions
which would relate not only to * ustralia but to the United Kin dol:,
the level of forces required ir the Rieserve, and this is a matter which
if Mr. Holyoake wished to raise it, would no douut be considered by
the overnment. I make no comment on that.
Q. ' That was actually discussed this morning in Cabinet?
P. 1. I am not to De cross-examined on a Cabinet discusjion. I do
not know what the practice is in this country but in my country Cabinet
discussions are confidential to Cauinet, and I regarded this one as a
confidential discussion subject to hat aoT., ars in the com. munique.
2. How long do you exnect the Vietnam , iar to continue?
I wish I krnew the answer to that one. I could plan with much
more certainty in my own country than is the case. I do not think anyone
can predict the course either of the hostilities or of the prospec
for the negotiations. e are a little more hopeful than we were. I
do not know how justified those hopes are that negotiitions could
emerge, perhaps at no very distant point of time, but I do not claim to
have substantial evidence that this is likely to be so. There have
been su restions in more recent times, appearinr rather more
fre uenTy than before, that this is a possibility, and I imagine
that the events that are occurring irn China would have produced some
review of their situation on the part of quite a number of eople in
various countries. 3ut as to the course of hostilitis, I do oelieve
that the position represents a very suostantial improvement on the
situation which existed 12 months ago. I came back myself last April
saying' I :! as convinced we had reached a point where the Viet Cong
the North Vietnamese could not win this conflict, but at the same
time I predicted that if we were able to meet successfully the more
highly organised attacks more highly or anised in the sense of
proceeding from lare bodies of men th i there would be a disposition
to revert, to Yuerilla tactics, and the fact that guerilla tactics
have substanti lly increased, I think is confirmation of the vier
I held then, and also some substantial evidence that they have not been
farin' well where they have engaged our forces by ours, I mean those
of South Vietnam, the ;' mericans and other friendly forces in the area
they have not been engaging them successfully.
Have there been any serious discussions in Australia on a Pacific
Trading Ijreement involving New Zealand, Australia, Japan, Canada,
and the United States,
F. M. No. It is the sort of thing that sometimes is canvassed in
academic argument or in the sort of speeches thit back-bench Members
make from time to time, but I would not say it has been seriously
entertained by any Jovernment of which I have an awareness. After
all there is no corresponding situation in Asia to that which exists
in Europe. The countries have very different stages of development,
very different stardards of industry and living, and while there is a
great trade developin and the trade between ' ustralia and Japan is
perhaps the most dramatic example I can point to, I wJould expect trade
generally uetween countries such -s our own and yours to increase as
population grows, consumption standards rise, as capacity to consume
increases these all have some beneficial trading effect for us.
i7e have, of course, a bilateral arrangement with Japan which by and
large is working very well. Certainly the trade is increasing very
satisfactorily. Q. You don't see any advantage in the idea at the moment?
P. M. 7ell, I don't regard it as practical politics or Dractical trading
at the present time, because there are significant differences, but that
does not mean there could not be useful bilateral arrangements.
Q. The EEC development su gests that Britain will eventually go into
the EEC and that hiw, Zealand and australia, as far as their own trade
with 3ritain is concerned, might be left outside. Do you think that this
will eventuall perhaps not in our lifetimes lead to economic
and perhaps political federation betweer Australia and lew ealand?
P. H. Y-u use the word'eventually' about entry to the Common iarket.
I don't think there is any early prospect ) f it from what one can
: gather from the exchanges that have taken place, but no one can predict
these things with certainty. as to eventual union of one form or
another between our two countries, the Frime Minister has to look to
the matters within his own likely ran e of ooeration and finds himself
busily enough occunied doing that, an I hav& not detected in either
of our two countries any widespre'. d sentiment in favour of such a
course. I think most thoughtful people realise the practical problems
which arise, out that is not to say that there can't be a strengthening
of unity in objective and in arrangements of a tr ding and security
kind. ' ie already have security partnerships in ANZUS rad SEATO. ' ne
have a trading agreement which has not yet run more than about 12
months and as I said at the lunch tody, it would certainly be our
wish that this should operate to the mutual benefit of both countries.
It is not desired that we should have a one-' ay benefit.
Q. Are you satisfied with the way the Free Trade Agreement is
working at the moment?
P. M. I do not claim to be an authority on the operation of the Free
Trade Agreement. My colleague John Lcien. inister for Trade, is
our specialist and expert on this, and he : ill oe ovor here shortly
and you will be aole to put questions of this sort to him and expect
more detailed and rather more authoritative answers on it. I have
gathered from our end, and indeed from this end, that its value is
accepted. I have found in my dealings with the Premiers of my own
States th-t if we reach agreement on something and one group eels it
is not working out as satisfactorily as both parties imagined it would,
they quickly make that know-n and we make adjustment accordingly.
Q. Mr. i. att suggested that there was some dissatisfaction on this side,
and your reply w: as that this would be only temporary because of drought.
i. ould you sort of
P. F. No I do not want you to read that into it. I think he was making
the point that in the year in which it had been in existence it had
not produced the results that had been hoped for at this end. 7ihile
I do not have the full explanation with me of the factors which may
have influenced trade over the past 12 months, I did point to one of / 3
the factors which could have affected the buoyancy of trade from
the Australian end. It has not been as lively a year for us as some of
the earlier ones in recent times, Lut we ' tre moving, we think., into
a more buoyant situation at the present time.
Q. Is there any sug estion that hew z" ealand might have to cut its
imports to Australia
P. M. Again, I do not , want to be pre-sed closely as to what were
entirely confidential discussions but I don't, by saying that,
want to convey the impression that the subject was ei her discussed
or thtt was the line of discussion. Don't read that into it. I
think these are matters which more appropriately could be put to
Hol oake.
Q. On the free trade business, I zet the impression that in Australia
they are reluctant to take finisheA products from New 4ealand. That
is, we have already struck trouble with paper pulp and kraft paern
plywood, and so on. Is there any likelihood of that attitude ceaning
up in the future?
P. You mentioned one conspicuous matter and I was told by mcolleague,
r. , Mc2wen, that this was one of the matters he would be
discussing wnhen he came over here. _ ut I have not gained the
impression myself, and frtnkly there has not been a -ood deal of
Cabinet discussion on this since the " oreement came into force but
I have not gained the inmpression mysel that it is working out
unsatisfa. ctorily. ho doubt if that is the vie;; held here it will
be conveyed to him ind he will be reporting back to us, but we have
a bi': country to tAminister. It has " t lot of proolems, and I do not
try To oe a specialist on all of them. I look to my M7inisters to
attend to those matters which fall within their own jurisdiction.
Q. Sir, Do you think there is any possibility or any advanta-e
in the eventual amalgamn. tion of iNew ] e-land and Austr-alian A" rmed
Forces? ' ell, a-ain that raises urobles uoth of a technical kind
matters of n' 1lional identity ifntters of national pride I suppcse,
also and we have found in the past when we have been linked
together nd resisting ag ression or firhting in the cause of
freedom that the forces o our two cournries got alon extremely
w. ell together. After all it us in that spirit that the anzac
tradition became establised. I am sure th: t the Service representatives
would be looking for ways and means to collaborate more effectively
together if they do hapren to be working in the field together. In
Vietnam for example, your artillery element there works in closely
with not only the ;' ustralian Artillery but in support of the , ustr. lian
Infantry. Q. Sir, Australia's military contributions for South East Asia are
much bi g-er and include things like conscripted troops, whereas hew
Zealand is much smaller ind we do not have conscription. Is there a
feeling in Australia that New Zealanders are not aware of the dangers
to this pirt of the world from enemies in South Iast Alsia?
P. M. I do not hear that discussed in Australia. I think most
Australians reco nise th. t just L s we have commitments in other
directions which affect the scale of contributions e can make Few
,, ela. nd his its own commitments and its own uroblems. Currently it
is facing the quite difficult problem of providing -ll the overseis
exchange it needs for its various purposes but, as I said earlier,
I am sure we will feel tha at ! ew 1ealand believes it can d should do,
can be safely left to the Jovernment of the Iew Zealand people. I may
say that sometimes you find th t the degree of support varies according
to geo-raphl I h-. ve , alwayfso und th t the people of Queensland who
were ciosesI to the threat of invasion during the last ur tndlwho
were close, of course to the battle of the Coral Sea., which had the
effect of nreventing the invasion of Australia, appear to be more
defence-minded, more sensitive to threats to their own security, than
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some of the southern areas. '. estern Austrilians, too, right at the
extreme side of the Continent, seemed to feel the more remote
because they are separated from us, not by water as you are, out
by a reat Ueal of territory includin 2 ood deal of desert.
They too sometimes feel a little isolte from the defence
stanpoint and press for more defence activity in their area.
lut I would not read too much into those matters. I think the
Nation as a whole revealed in the course of the last election that
it ws giving substantial support to Jovernment policies in this
field. Q. gould you care to co:; ment on some of r. Arthur Calwell's
statements and activities when '' arshal Ky came to Australia?
P. M. I did not think it appropriate to o so in Australia, and
I have not come here to New eiland to say things about him here
I was not disposed to say in my own country. I think Februtry
8th will be a critical day so far s he is concerned, * nd I will
wait until I learn hat his intentions are on that day.
Q. Do you foresoe any move towards or need for the re-armament
of Japan in years to come, or a defence alliance between Australia
or New Zealand and Japan, particularly if the Chinese hostilities
continue? F. YE. ell, you are getting into a field of thinking which would
be beyond my owin cornetence at nresent. This raises issues in
Japan s relations ; ih much larger countri! s than ours, and of course
relates also to its own special situation in th . t area of the world.
I do not feel I can make 1 useful comment about it.
Q. In your talks this morning did you discuss Indonesia? Did you
talk sout the supply of credit from Australia?
F. M. o. ut I don't -ant to get to answers by exhausting other
possibilities. Q. You have had decimal currency for a year now-. . e are going to
change in July. Some neople come nack from trips to Australia and
say you are having all sorts of problems with it. Other people
come vack and say it is as simple as a breeze. Could you give us
some idea for people here?
F. M. As in most st: btements at poles of the extreme, there is something
to be said, I suppose in between in respect of it. Those of us who had a
large part to play with the introduction of decimal currenc and
it was planned n'd carried through durin my own period s Treasurur
in the Commonwealth have been * rtified by the smoothness of the
transition and the absence of difficulties which we had anticipated.
When you become accustomed to a particulhr currency through your
lifetime, it does call for some mental adjustment. Even I find myself
at times converting back into pounds from dollars so th tt I wvill have
a clearer idea of just what it is I am asked to pay for something.
This even occurs on the race course. In the first weeks I had to work
out how much I would normally have put on this horse in pounds, mnd
relate that to dollars. But what you might call the machinery aspects,
I think, have functioned extremely * ell. By mnlchinery I am not
thinking in particulir of the conversion of the machinery with E. S. D.
symbols over to the dollar letterir. ThaLt is going ahead well in
front of schedule. I think it is Wout seven months ahead of schedule
and this has been pleasing. The cost of the conversion worked out
at less than we had originally estim-ted. Thtt, too, was gratifying.
At the moment we are passin' throu--h this more awkward stage :. hich
is unavoidable in a transition of This kind whee you do have some
machines working on one letterin and others w orking on the new
decimal lettering. You do have some of the old coins current together
with the new decimal coins, but I think most people are finding it a
much easier adjustment than they had contenplate and the advantages
of it undoubtedly far outwei h may temporary inconvenience. The
oun er generation of Australia ns and ew Zealanders are -oing to
enefit from this in their education. 1e were finding mentioned
this yesterday to someone here that the larger firms in Australia,
before decimalisation was introduced were conducting their accounts
inside their organisations on the b'sis of decimals and then
converting back into pounds, shillins and pence for any transactions
that went on outside. I think this is pretty good proof that there
was a substantial convenience in accountancy, anyhow, in workinr
on the decimal basis. ,7e will settle down to it much more quicly
than -ie had earlier anticipted, and the fact that not only your
country but the United Kirdom As now decided to go decimalo I
think is further proof th'N it is worth while.
Q. Y'ere there many com plhints in your country from consumers about
prices going up after the change-over?
P. 1. There were a lot of predictions beforehand that traders would
take advantage of this or thit, rices would go up, but if I recollect
correctly and I think I do the movement in our Consumrer Index
wl-s rather smaller after decimalisation, certainly within the last
quarter just under review when decimal currency had been in effect
some time. There are other causes which sear on movements in the
Consumer Index even the actions of uovernments in nutting up fares
and rates and the excise on beer and tobatcco. These things all come
into the Consumer Index. He studied this quite closely in Australia,
lookin at the South frican experience, ind there is no evidence
in South Africa thft costs have risen beyond what might have been
re-arded as the normal order of progression certainly at no higher
ra e than in the period preceding decinalisation.
Q. 7ith the end of Indonesian confrontation and the comparative
stability in South 7est Asi, how long do you foresee a need for the
Commonwealth StrLtegic Reserve?
P. M. I would hone it would continue indefinitely, because I am
quite certain th'it it provides, with the British presence in that
area of the world, a stabilising and moderatinZ influence whose
presence is not resented by the Jovernments of the two cnuntries
most closely associated geogrphically Malaysi or Singapore. I
am sure they welcome the adied securi ty the presence there brings
to them. when the Minister for Defence w. s here in Australia and
presumably your Dean Eyre was over with us 2, t the time there was
some feelinx then tha-i. t the British might in the ne-r future or by
1970 move their troons from that area. . e emphasised how important
we felt it to be that they should remain there, and were very
oratified tha-. t the United Kingdom Toverrment subsequently announced
it proposed to keep them there indefinitely rovidin-that their
presence was accepable to the countries most intimaely concerned.
So I do not see an early movement back of troons in the Strategic
Reserve. In any event we would not be likely to reduce our
establishment. are currently building up the ' ustraian Re ular
Army establishnent to about 40,000 personnel md whether you fiave
them stationed in Australia, or at some noint such as this ;; here
the are tle to deal more quickly with troulle should it emerge, is a
matter of military advice expert technicl advice, I think. There
are political questions which arise also but we look at the complex
of these things to see what ought to be Aone.
Q. Has there been any discus ion of further ustralian credit for
New Zealand following the pounds twelve million loan which we obtained
late last year?
I ell, I have no comment to mrke on thit.
Q. Has it been raised?
Do you imean today, or for th: at matter at any earlier point of
time, no.
Q. Referring in a rather round-about way to military conscription
in Australia, did your Jovernment not wish -t some stige or other
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that it would have oeen simpler to detach troops from the
Commonwealth Strategic Reserve rather than introduce conscription?
en we introduced conscription and perhaps I should remind
you, not that in any ay I wish to avoid the issue, but as a matter
of historical fact, the decision in relation to that matter was taken
before my Jovernment came into existence. I was a supporter of the
decision and a party in the Cabinet to its adoption, but it was not
a decision which wis taken during my own term. We implemented it, and
the decision to introduce national service training and to make use
of national service trainees for overseas service ' as based on the
best military advice we could secure and at the time we would not have
found it racticable to use the Strategic ieserve and serve the
commitments for which they were intended and at the same time have
the numer of troops we wanted available for participation in the
Vietnam conflict. It was to us a necessary decision, and I think the
Australian Electorate has now accepted that fact.
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