PRIME MINISTER
TRANSCRIPT OF THE PRIME MINISTER, THE HON P J KEATING MP
JOINT PRESS CONFERENCE WITH MINISTERS COLLINS AND
FAULKNER, PARLIAMENT HOUSE, CANBERRA, MARCH 30 1995
E& OE PROOF COPY
PM: As most of the people in this room are very well aware, we have had a
somewhat seminal debate in Australia about the twin objectives of
being able to protect those areas of native forest and wilderness that
are pertinent to the heritage of Australians, and the need to maintain
and develop further, a sustainable wood products industry. This
debate, of course, has raged in Australia for a very long period of time,
and while the Commonwealth Government doesn't operate the forests,
they are operated by the States. The community looks to the
Commonwealth for leadership, to see that these great national assets
are protected, or at least define the basis in policy upon which we can
arrive at a system where we can seek both to protect them and at the
same time, allow a wood products industry to prosper. Today the
Cabinet met to consider a strategy for the long-term future of
Australia's native forests and its industry, and agreed to a number of
measures I suppose prime amongst them was to ensure that by the
year 2000, Australia will have a system of reserves comprehensively
representing all forest types, while at the same time, a diverse wood
products industry. As the first step in this and this is against the
backdrop, of course, of the National Forest Policy Statement, and the
commitment of States to it the first step in this is a discussion paper
which will be released by the Government, detailing the
Commonwealth's position for a future forest reserve system. The aim
will be to stimulate public comment on the appropriate criteria, and
during the six-week consultation phase, the Commonwealth will be
working with State and Territory governments to develop nationally
agreed criteria for application in the development in Regional Forest
Agreements for more regions. Now, we think that with the co-operation
of the States, the Commonwealth can use these criteria to undertake a
preliminary reserve analysis to set aside areas pending completion of
Regional Forest Agreements. And this should enable the 1996
woodchip export licences to be issued on a regional rather than a
coupe-by-coupe basis, which of course you will know is a change from
that which we have had. 0 1 201
So our strategy will be to make sure that the Government's policy of
protecting high conservation value forests, in perpetuity, will not be
compromised while Regional Forest Agreements are being developed,
and industry will enjoy more certainty about the availability of
resources. These Regional Forest Agreements will identify areas for
incorporation in the National Reserve System, and adequately and
comprehensively represent all forest types and areas which may be
harvested on a strict basis of ecological sustainability. And we hope
that we will be able to undertake over the next ten weeks consultations
with a view to finalising this document by the middle of the year. Now,
can I also say that Cabinet today has also agreed to recommend to the
Minister for Resources that he ask woodchip companies to refrain from
sourcing woodchips from 264 coupes that Cabinet believes might be
required for a future reserve system, and that were originally proposed
for the States in 1995.
Now, I will go to those in a moment, but let me take you through quickly
for our own memory a little bit of mathematics: originally the
Commonwealth set aside for investigation as to the representativeness
or otherwise, 509 coupes. During the course of that setting aside, 110
coupes were released for logging on two lots there were 57 and 53.
This left 399: of the 399, 37 have been withdrawn but the states,
because they no longer want to log in those areas for woodchips,
which left 362, and of that 362, the Commonwealth is seeking or the
Cabinet is seeking with the agreement of the Minister for Resources,
to oblige companies to refrain from sourcing from 264 of those coupes.
So, I will . as a consequence of that change, I will be asking the
States to fully protect all those coupes, including the non-national
estate coupes we set aside pending finalisation of the Regional Forest
Agreements. Now, the Government recognises of course that
requesting companies to stay out of areas proposed by states for
logging will have consequences for the livelihood of some forest
workers. The Government will provide income support under existing
programs for those people. For any self-employed people, the
Government will consider the payment of transitional assistance. And,
of course, local CES offices will be active in ensuring that workers are
made aware of their programs and are eligible to join, and that other
forms of assistance are immediately available to them. The
Government has developed a tailored package of assistance available
immediately for self-employed workers, employees and their families
affected by structural adjustment to the industry. The Forest Industry
Special Assistance Package will provide individuals with access to
training and employment programs under Working Nation, including
the National Training Wage, JobStart and JobSkills, and assist with
relocation and travel costs. And so we will then talk with the States
about a range of projects that may be employed for employment
opportunities, such as plantation and farm forestry etc.
So, perhaps I might return to this theme, and say that what we are
seeking here is to take the view that the best policy for Australia is to
have both of these things: one, a policy that protects forever the
unique and irreplaceable nature of our forests, and develop the
profitable and sustainable forest industry. Now we think there is a
point of computability here, and mutually reinforcing quality to that. It
is possible that Australia can develop a model industry, and in the
development of representative reserve systems, do so with the
injunction to think global and act local. Because I think it is possible
for Australia, at this juncture where we have had this debate running
now for so many years, it will get back to the development of these
Regional Forest Agreements around the comprehension of the paper
the discussion paper we are now to present while in the interim,
keeping those 264 coupes until their qualities can be assessed in
terms of those representative reserve systems. Were we able to reach
that point, Australia would truly have a representative forest system,
where all species are adequately represented. And I think you will
find, also, we are talking there about a broad benchmark roughly of the
order of 15% of the pre-1788 distribution of each forest community,
and that is in terms of representing it in statutory conservation
reserves. So, we are talking here to a very high standard about the
representativeness of any such reserve system, while at the same
time, seeking to move the industry into a position of sustainability and
so we avoid this position of coupe-by-coupe discussions every year,
rather than discussions on a regional basis where we can actually
agree to regions having a capacity to export and not simply us looking
or being obliged to look coupe-by-coupe.
Now, there have been many critics of this process, but you have to
understand that the Commonwealth is not the manager of forests. The
Commonwealth database could only and always depend on the
information given to it by States, forestry authorities and by scientific
analysis and re-analysis of the information which is sent. These are
the things that Nations have to do to move towards that sort of a
system, but let me say it is a far better approach than the approach of
our opponents who believe and this is the belief of the Spokesperson
for the Environment that the Commonwealth shouldn't be using its
external affairs powers, should not be signatory to international treaties
and wouldn't be using the export powers to advance this debate in any
way, shape or form, and where the coalition is taking the view that
even a policy of restraining clear-felling is not one that they should
adopt. This is difficult as it is the only way to move towards this sort
of a system, and let me say clearly, building on, what I think is the very
significant and internationally significant environment record of the
Government over now a long period of time, that it was only ever to be
this Government that would come to terms with our native forests and
the timber being taken from them, in the context of some sustainable
reserve system. And those who have been chortling at the difficulties
of evaluation, should understand that no great endeavour such as this
would ever be easily attained, and it can never, of course, be secured
without there being a systemic approach to forest management in
Australia. So I think that says in the general that which I wish to say.
Could I just say I would like to express my appreciation to my two
colleague Ministers beside me for a long process of consultation and
negotiation and discussion that they have had including, of course,
with the Minister for Resources, and the Minister for Industry, Science
and Technology towards arriving at this position, and I think again
this is what marks out the Government from the Coalition that we have
people of this calibre able to take on these sensitive tasks, who
understand the nuances of them and try to reach at a position that they
can defend. Now, I'm not sure whether either of them wish to
complement my remarks they are very welcome to, and I would invite
Senator Collins should he choose.
BC: I'll just take questions Paul.
JF: I'm happy to take questions.
PM: Well, they are happy to take questions I think we all are.
J: Prime Minister, you have announced 264 coupes which won't be given
approval for woodchip exporting the State governments still have
control over land-use matters in terms of logging how confident are
you that logging won't go on in any of those coupes, or could it be that
logging will go in some of those coupes?
PM: What we are saying is this we have asked the States to protect these
coupes until we go into this broader discussion about representative
reserve systems it has always been a State prerogative to the
Commonwealth export powers have only ever gone as far as
woodchips, and if the States wish to continue to give approval to
logging for saw-log or veneer they are able to do that. This still
remains the position, but I think States do want to get on with the
development of a representative reserve system and I think we are at
the stage where a number of projects which value-add to the pulp and
paper and timber industry in this country are in the offing, but may
never come to fruition without the development of such a system. So I
think States will bear upon, will consider this question. Can I say that
some of these coupes, of course, are in NSW that is to be released for
export woodchipping, and these will be the subject of discussion with
the incoming Carr Labor Government in NSW.
J: Prime Minister, what is your estimate of the employment impact of this
decision?
PM: It varies in certain places, I think we do have a compilation of the
number I don't have it with us. I don't think we can accurately say
that here....
BC: It would be impossible, at this stage can I say to accurately predict
that, but it is clear that there may be some job losses, and that is
acknowledged in the Statement in the sense that this is the
consideration Cabinet has given to what we do about that, but a lot of
that will depend, I have to say, on a fairly intensive period of
discussions we will now have to embark on with the States in terms of
what arrangements can be made to minimise that effect, and there will
be arrangements that can be made in terms of rescheduling where it's
possible and so on. But, I think the important thing to note and I don't
know if you have got them yet but there are two important discussion
papers that are being released here this afternoon. One on the criteria
that will be used to establish reserve systems, and the other on an
industry plan. Now, both of those papers I have to say have been
developed after a very intensive period of consultation. The criteria
paper is an important one that was developed after a high-level
scientific group chaired by the Chief Scientist reported to the
Government, and indeed, the Government has drawn very heavily on
that report, in putting that criteria discussion paper together. And it is
important to understand, I think, just how vital a document that is
because if in negotiations with the States we can achieve that, it will be
a world best in terms of reserve systems there is no question about
that. The International Union of Conservation an Nature which is the
international body that determines World Heritage status has
recommended a 10% reserve system of existing resources. Canada
which is a heavy forest nation has around 13% of its existing
resources in reserves, the United States [ has] around This
recommendation will secure 15% of Australia's original forest resource.
Now the reason that this has happened, is that we are in the unique
position in the sense that we still have 60% of that original resource in
Australia, but that equates to around 25% of the existing forest
resource in aggregate in reserves, which will be world best practice.
J: Prime Minister, you said that this system that you have just outlined
should be removed by 1996, you need the coupe-by-coupe
assessment because there will be regional agreements in place does
that mean in 1995 there will be another coupe-by-coupe assessment,
will we have to go through this process again?
PM: Well, I'm saying that if we are able to advance this process at the
speed I think we would like to, that is, that we are able to detect the
position before we actually get to RFAs, it may be possible to do that.
But again, that would depend on co-operation.
BC: And I might add, as I am sure you are aware, the situation in
respective reserves differs widely across Australia from state to state.
Some states are in far better shape than others.
J: Which states... . of the protection . coupes?
PM: Well, I think you will see that in the broad when we publish information.
But of course, this will be published after the decision by the Minister
for Resources.
BC: The important thing, I think, in that consideration is the same criteria
applied across the board, and that is the central criteria of putting
aside those coupes which the Government considered necessary to
establish a comprehensive, adequate and representative resource
system in Australia. So even though there are regional differences it is
important to note that those regional differences are reflected in the
different states of the reserve systems in those states.
J: Is it true that coupes were in New South Wales and most of the
( inaudible)
PM: Well, I think you will have to wait for the publication of the decision. As
I have already indicated to you that we will be speaking to the New
South Wales Government, so obviously we can't be saying to you what
we might do in New South Wales before:
a. the Minister the for Resources having made a decision and
b. the New South Wales government being consulted.
J: Loggers are threatening to bring their trucks back if they are unhappy
with the result. Are you confident that this is the end of the ramble
over the 1995 logging
PM: Well, I said at the time to representatives of the timber industry that it
is only under this Government will they get the option of having a
sustainable wood forest products industry because I think only we
have the inclination and the capacity to deliver a reserve system and
you have already seen that. You are already seeing the Coalition
spokesperson saying that they believe, he believes that these
questions of land management are exclusively state issues. He is
saying that he opposes any use of treaties or the external affairs
power. Now, if that were to be the position of any Coalition
government, I think it does follow logically that this Government is the
only one capable of delivering any system that resembles
sustainability in forest products.
J: Mr Keating, are you saying that the Minister for Resources hasn't yet
given a tick to these Cabinet decisions?
PM: No, this is the Cabinet's recommendation to him and he will consider
that and he will announce the decision.
BC: Which is the statutory process.
J: How confident are you of state co-operation particularly with
Tasmania?
PM: Well, I think there is a general willingness on the part of the Premier to
sign the Forest Policy Statement and to be in the development of a
regional forest agreement. But there is no doubt a lot of stresses and
strains within the Tasmanian cabinet with the former Premier, Mr Gray
and others seeking to undermine the Premier. But, again, everyone
there must think about the long-run interests of Tasmania and its
forests and its forest's industries. So, I think the nature of these
decisions will encourage the Tasmanian government to be part of the
process.
JF: I think the other thing that ought to be said in relation to state
co-operation is this, that the most recalcitrant state in terms of working
with the other states and the Commonwealth to develop a
comprehensive, adequate and representative resource system has
been New South Wales. From the middle of last year, New South
Wales has refused to even release a discussion paper developed by
the states on the criteria for a comprehensive, adequate and
representative reserve system. We do have a change in government,
of course, in New South Wales, a new Premier and new government
elected on a platform of protection and conservation of areas of high
conservation value of native forests and I think the Commonwealth can
look forward to a lot more co-operation from the New South Wales
government and in the area of the development of the Carr reserve
criteria and comprehensive regional assessments where the
Commonwealth had offered to fund New South Wales on old growth
and wilderness surveys, all the offers of Commonwealth funding and
assistance have been rejected now for a number of years. I think we
can confidently look forward to a very different attitude and a very
positive attitude from the incoming New South Wales government.
J: Prime Minister, do you think... original list is something like 1300?
PM: Well, did the original list have any veracity in terms of
representativeness and in terms of the other qualities that were
ascribed to and I think that the answer to that is no. There has been
the development here of an approach which has been consistently
applied. As Senator Collins has said, where there has been multiple
checking with the states between Commonwealth offices and
Commonwealth agencies and the states. Under that criteria of the
status of these coupes and again, I think one of the outcomes in this is
that those who are going around saying there were 1300 pristine
stands of trees etc, can't defend that position. So therefore, their
credibility must suffer accordingly.
J: Prime Minister, does the credibility of those who go around saying
there were only 86 that should be protected, they must also suffer
given you have now decided
PM: Well, I don't think that the Cabinet took the view that it accepted that
view. It took the view that was not acceptable.
BC: I might add all those lists had the caveat on them, all of them, that they
were all subject to further assessment. That assessment has now
been concluded.
J: Prime Minister, how much... what is the estimated cost of the
assistance package to the timber workers?
BC: No, that hasn't finally been determined but the Cabinet did determine
today that there will be a substantial package of financial support for
the industry and that will be announced in the Budget in terms of the
actual quantum of that amount. But there will be a substantial amount
of support provided by the Government. I might add the central
premise of that industry statement which is available for you and to get
back to your previous question, the central premise of that whole
industry statement is that it is a fact that you will never satisfy the
extremes in both sides of this debate. Of the industry paper, in fact,
says is what we know can be done, that is that we can establish in
Australia a vibrant and a value added timber industry in Australia at
the same time as maintaining the conservation values that must be
protected. It can be done.
J: Prime Minister, when exactly do we find out about this...( inaudible)...?
PM: That will be soon, but there is statutory process here and it is important
that it is followed.
J: How do you propose to deal with the hostility of Green groups on this
and other environment issues in the lead-up to the next election?
PM: Well the Green groups have got to be able to sustain, if one wants to
make an extravagant argument, you have got to be able to sustain an
extravagant position. I think what this evaluation reveals is that the
extravagance of the claims of about 1300 coupes could not be
sustained and was incredible. And also remember that I said in a
statement last year that we will be moving to phase out woodchipping
outside of those places from whence timber comes under an RFA. So,
the first, if you like, substantial steps to changing the nature of this
industry has always in this country come from the Labor Government,
this Labor Government.
And I just might add again, for those who think this is of no account
that in the last year we did reserve these important areas of the
national estate such as Shoalwater Bay and Jervis Bay and we put
$ 24 million in the Budget to buy back the Hole in the Heart of the
Daintree and seek to move down the path of developing a sustainable
basis for the wood products industry in the context of the preservation
of important heritage of native forests and forests of heritage value.
BC: I might add that a central element for the conservation movement in
terms of their interests and Australia's interests is the extension of the
reserve system in Australia and a number of weeks ago, I publicly
supported Tricia Caswell's statement of the ACF about the importance
of this central element in this package and I will just reiterate that the
Government has accepted the advice of Professor Pitman, the Chief
Scientist, and the committee that he gathered around him in terms of
the 15 per cent criterion, I have just indicated with two brief examples,
one Canada and one the United States, the criteria the Government
has adopted is way in front of the word's best in terms of resources.
JE: If I can just make a very brief comment. The number of coupes that
the Prime Minister has indicated that the Cabinet has recommended to
the Minister for Resources is far and away the greatest number that
have ever been protected through an application of the export
woodchip licence renewal process. There is no other number of
coupes in any previous year that is in anyway close to that same order
of magnitude.
J: Why couldn't your Government come up with this number last year?
JF: The key thing that needs to be remembered here is that the National
Forest Policy Statement has as its fundamental conservation element
or objective the establishment of a comprehensive, adequate and
representative reserve system. There has been slow progress on the
establishment of criteria for that reserve system, particularly courtesy
of the New South Wales government, but we have really been able to
progress that over the last few months and that is the key conservation
objective of the NFPS and it is going to deliver as well in my view, the
industry plan real and tangible, long-term environmental benefits. That
has been the very significant move forward that we have seen and I
think it really is a demonstration that we are serious in terms of
delivering on an environmental agenda.
PM: Can I just add to that. You need to understand also, I think, that the
days of locking away areas which, I suppose were never easy but
much easier than development a federal compact between the
Commonwealth and the states on forests, there was a very large
transition from that and the high expectations have generated as
always to the hard tack of a sustainable system. Now this has
happened over the period when Ros Kelly was Minister for the
Environment with a National Forest Policy statement and now with
John Faulkner. But there is always an expectation, particularly
amongst Green groups, that we can be kicking goals on reserves
which has in fact happened when there was a much easier delineation
of important stands of areas of the national estate now. Just the same
as it's fallen to this Government to deal with Aboriginal land rights or
Aboriginal health. It is into the hard areas of change and I think the
co-efficient ( inaudible).., rises when you try and get into a
sustainable system of this variety. And those who seek to easily
criticise Ministers should understand that the degree of difficulty is
very much greater than it has been in the past.
J: Prime Minister, just on the reserves, would you agree that there could
be widely different impacts depending on the region of Australia we
are talking about because of different patterns of land clearing since
white settlement, for example a 15 per cent minimum reserve in
northern New South Wales or parts of northern New South Wales and
Queensland could mean reserving all the remaining forests or where in
Gippsland, for example, where there are large stands of certain types
of forests, it could lead to a big increase in the amount of logging
simply to be kept because it is 15 per cent of a much bigger area of
type of forest?
PM: Well, I think we have just seen a big state plebiscite run on some of
those policies with Bob Carr. He said quite up-front where thinks that
the balance of that argument should go.
JF: Our approach is in Australia, from a Commonwealth Government
perspective with the release of this paper, to see a high-level of
biodiversity conservation. As Bob Collins has said, it is 15 per cent. It
is virtually higher than anywhere else in the world. We are also
developing specific criteria for wilderness and old-growth levels of
reservation and they are very significant steps forward in this particular
debate and obviously will have application as we move through into
the future in further rounds of decisions in relation to the issue of
export woodchip licences.
PM: Can I perhaps conclude on this point that is that the Minister for
Resources will consider the Cabinet's recommendation and make a
decision and that of course will be published. The broad numbers in
that recommendation have been given to you today and I am confident
that if we can get down to the consultation period finished by mid-year
we will have a reasonably firm basis to make decisions for 1996 other
than on a coupe-by-coupe basis which will be important to us. But
perhaps I can conclude on this very last point, of thanking Bob Collins
and John Faulkner for a very large and sustained committed effort to
this very intractable problem and trying to see that in this country we
can do something the rest of the world has not been able quite to do
and to do it well.
ends.