AS
4 US AL 4 LrAt
PRIME MINISTER
TRANSCRIPT TALKBACK RADIO, 8DN ( COMMCIAL) DARWINg31 MARCH 1.989
2 & O0E-PROOF ONLY
Col Xrohns Quite a few things in the news this morning in
relation to the PM'. visit to the Top End, We see where in
particular the algae road, something which has been an urgency,
is to go ahead. More than $ 7m in roadworks to help tourism in
Central Australia. This was announced yesterday and of course a
treaty that's going to be headed up this is the proposal by the
Prime Minister, an eminent persons group to help draw up a
pyeraopr osseod iAtb'osr iagliln ahla pTpreenaitnyg iinn ttihmee Tfoopr Eintd taot bet hissi gnteimde . l, a tesro tIh'ilsl
just check to see if indeed we do have the P M on the line.. Mr
Hawke good morning.
PM: Good morning Coll can you speak up I can hardly hear you
KROHNt OK how's that.
PM It's a little bit better.
KROHN: Thanks very much f or joining us. I know you'Ive got a big
programme this morning so just brief ly bef ore we take our f irst
call you have made quite an impact of course with your visit to
the Northern Territory, particularly in relation to the money
that's going to be spent on the upgrading of the road to the
Olga. and of course one that's been in need f or a long time and
the Treaty. You want to set up an eminent persons group to help
draw up the proposed Aboriginal Treaty in time for Lt. to be
eirned later this year. Do you believe that this is the way to
go. PM: on the question of the Treaty I'm not saying it will be
completed by the end of this year, what I've said is that I think
we are going to see the processes under way this year of fuller
consultation going on within the Aboriginal community itself.
They want to talk themselves about the sort of things they want
to see and I think we'll see during this year, and beyond, the
processes of discussion, consultation, explanation within the
non-aboriginal community where I see a role for people of stature
who, right across the Australian society, will be seen as people
who understand these issues and have only-a concern for the
welfare of Australia talking about it and those procesues I see
as going on in a way which one it would be nice to believe that
that could come to fruition within the life of this parliament
but I said this probably will go into the lifea of the next, the
important thing is that these processes, you know, be under way.
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KROHN: Mr Prime Minister we won't take too much of your time.
We'll take our first call right away and the caller waiting for
you goes by the name of Scotty. Scotty you're through to the
Prime minister, go ahead.
SCOTTY: Good morning Mr Hawke.
PXs Good Morning.
SCOTTYs How are you air
PM: I'm very well thank you very much.
SCO'DTYt Now Sir, can I ask you a question ( Yep) in the last
fortnight, in the paper was a statement Pensioners rates are to
go up by $ 50 ( yes) Now is that a fact or is that just a
publicity stunt by the Northern Territory news
PM. Well I don't know who said Pensioners Rates will go up by
but there's no authority for that statement. What is the case is
what's your name by the way? ( Scotty) Scotty ( yes) Scotty
what the fact is is that there's going to be improvements in the
arrangements for elderly citiziens and thats.. .1st me Just very
quickly tell you what I've been doing about that. We commissioned
a report which we received at the end of last year and on
that.. that was from Professor Cass.. which was looking at the
whole question of retirement incomes policy. We received that
report and what I've had done nov is having a range of
consultations on the basis of that report with organisations
representing the elderly citizens and with the Superannuation
industry and also I had a back-bench committee of mine going
around Australia just listening to the elderly and we're
receiving those reports now and as a result of that the Minister,
Mr Howe, will be coming to us with a range of proposals for
improvements in the area of retirement income policy so people
are entitled to understand yes that there will be improvements in
the arrangements for our elderly citizen. but we can't at this
stage Scotty put a figure on it. B ut what I can say is that that
will be based upon a record to this point where when we cam to
of fice the pension, as a percentage Iof average weekly earnings
was just 22 and a half percent, we've brought that up to
percent. In our period of office there's been a real increase in
pensions of 8% as against a 4% reduction when Howard was
Treasurer-so we've got the runs on the board. But we're not
satisfied we are going to do more and that will happen this year.
SCOTTY: Thank you very much indeed
PM: Thank you Scotty.
XROHNa Thanks for your call Scotty. We'll take our next call,
Kevin you're through to the Prime Minister, go ahead Kevin.
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KEVIN: Hello ( yes) Mr Prime MInister could I ( Your name is
Kevin is it?) That's correct. ( Yes Kevin) It can be-. seen that
the Federal Government is spending millions of dollars on the
Aboriginal Deaths in Custody inquiry ( yes) as I see it it seems
to be unfair when reports say that the deaths in custody
concern., or more deaths in custody concern non-aboriginal
inmates. That being the case is your Government prepared to set
up a Royal Commission to look into the issue of white deaths in
custody. If not, why not?
PMt With respect that's not really the right way if you look at
it as a proportion, you know, of the population it is a much
higher incidence amongst aborigines. But I'd just make this pint
that it may very well be the case and we haven't received the
final report as you'd appreciate, it may very well be the case
that as a result of the work of the Royal Commission which I
might remind you is not simply being done by the Commonwealth but
with the co-operation of each of * the states, in other words the
commitment and the involvement in this investigation into deaths
in custody is not simply a commonwealth Labor Government
initiative. I pay full tribute to all my colleagues around the
States, non Labor as well as Labor persuasion are involved in it
but what I'm saying is this, that it may well be as a result of
the Investigations that facts and recopmmendations will come out
of that which will be relevant not simply to the question of
deaths of Aboriginals in custody but may go, may have
implications for the whole prison population or potential prisc_
population and for procedures to be adopted by police and by
prisons which will have benefit for the whole population.
KEVIN: this would mean then that the terms of reference would
have to be changed?
PMs No it doesn't mean anything of the sort because it mean.
obviously that if Royal Commissioners are examining procedures
that are follo * wed by police and by prison of ficials that that
examination of procedures may very well, and is very likely
indeed, to have relevance for prisoners other than Aboriginal
prisoners. KEVINs Right. In fact your answer to my question at this stage isthat
you're waiting on the report fro...
PM: Well we've received interim reports from the Royal
Commissioner, Commissioner Muirhead, and as a result of those
interim reports there've already been meetings of the
Commonwealth and State, Ministers and Officials and there are the
beginning of changes in procedures. I'm simply saying that the
final series of actions that will be taken,-undertaken and that
is essentially by the states because it is in their areas of
administration where these things basically happen, that we won't
get final answers and won't be able to make the final judgment on
outcomes until we get those final reports.
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KROHN: Thanks Kevin, thanks for your call. Mr Prime Minister
we'll move on right away we do have a full board. Gary, you're
through to the Prime Minister.
GARY: Ah. hello Mr Prime Minister ( yes Gary) I just want to ask
you a couple of questions. Can you please tell me who's going to
be looking after airport security when the FAC take over.
PM Well the whole question of airport security is a matter which
has got to be considered by the Federal Cabinet Gary. Currently
the major.. well there's a shared responsibility, the major
responsibility is undertaken by Federal Police but with
involvement by state forces. As a matter of fact the Federal
Cabinet is going to be examining this issue to see how we can
increase the effectiveness of airport security and it may be that
there will be so me greater handing over of this responsibility to
the states .0 have to accept some financial
responsibility and involvement but that's a matter which is
currently being considered.
GARY a I heard that there' s gunna be retrenchments of the APP
throughout Australia-.
PM: No it wouldn't be a question of retrenchment, I mean there's
no intention to reduce Federal Police numbers. If in fact we
come to an arrangement with the states in terms of handing over
more responsibility to them it's not going to involve a loss of
jobs for APP.
KROHNs Just on that if I may submit a point. I understand that
the cutbacks according to the... some of the figures, could lead
to industrial action in relation to this.
ix: With the APP No there the APP have some concerns at
the moment but this has got nothing to do with any suggested
cutbacks in regard to airport security. There are some concerns
in the APP and in fact the Minister, Senator Tate, who has a
direct responsibility in this area will be coming to me next wveek
with suggestions and recommendations dealing with some of the
concerns of the APP but that is a matter which is separate fromand
will be dealt separately and will be dealt with
separately from any questions of airport security.
GARY: OK thank you Mr. Prime Minister, thank you very much.
KROHN: OX thanks for your call Gary. Apparently there is a
meeting right around the nation this morning by Federal Police on
this one according to Mr Small who is the Federal Police
Association National Assistant Secretary, Mr Hawks, he says that
there'd be $ 2.2 million over budget by the end of the financial
year if costs weren't restrained.
P~ s Yeah well, an I say Col. there are some concerns they have in
Canberra. we've had some particular problems which have revolved
around the diversion of resources that have been necessary in
investigating the Winchester murder and so these whole range of
concerns will be before me as a result of submissions to me-by
the Minister in this coming week.
KROHNs OR we'll move along Mr Prime Minister. Isobel is your next
caller, you're through to the PM Isobel.
ISOBEL: Hello ( Hello Isobel-H~ ow are you?) I'm fine. ( How old are
you?) I'm twelve ( Twelve are you?) Turning twelve soon ( Good on
you) I'm doing a project on Indonesia ( yes) and could you tell me
if Australia's helping Indonesia in any ways? ( if we're helping
Indonesia yes.
PH: Well I think the right way of putting it is we're helping
Indonesians. We have some aid programmes with Indonesia, not in
the defence area so much as in other areas which will be of
assistance in helping the development of the Indonesian economy.
we're trying to build up relations with Indonesia. They've gone
through, I suppose it's fair to say, over recent year. we've had
rocky periods in our relations but this is a country of as you
know, very very many people and it's the most populous neighbour
that we have, imediate neighbour, so it's very important Isobel
that we have good and friendly relations with the people of
Indonesia. We've had differences with them, particularly an you
know going back, as you would have been taught, going back to the
last decade over the action they took in regard to the
incorporation of East Timor into Indonesia and there were some
serious difficulties we had at that time. We still are watching
with interest, and they appreciate that, the question of the
treatment of people in East Timor. But we now have a relationship
with the Government which enables urn to talk freely about these
things but to do so on a basis of trying to get growing cooperation
with them so that we can help the people of Indonesia
build up their economy so that they can be better of f and that we
also will be able to have better trading relationships with them
as well as relationships in other fields. We've just recently
established, Isobel, an Australian-Indo nes ian Foundation which
will have people who will advise us on how we can develop
relations with them in a whole range of field., cultural and
sporting fields for instance, so that we can have, you know, a
better, more productive relationship.
KROHN: Ok Isobel? Thank you very much ( P? 1: thank you Isobel) OR
moving along with another lady, Kathy, you're through to the
Prime Minister Kathy, go ahead.
KATHY: Uh Hi, I'm 17 years old right
PM: I'm sorry I didn't catch your name ( My name's Kathy) Kathy?
( yeah) Could you speak up Kathy?
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KATHYt OK I'm Just about 17 years old ( yeah) and I left school
about when I was 15 ( When you were when I was 15 ( Yeah)
and I'm looking for a job right 7 and everyone advertises for-16
to 18 year olds with a year's experience and that's really hard
to get, you know, when you're 17 and you've just left school
( yeah) and you know that's really stupid ( beg your pardon
that's really stupid and I was wondering why people do that, same
with Social security and things like that, you know.
PM Why are they saying.. I'm sorry why are they saying you need
experience? KATHY: Yeah you find advertisements in the paper -for 16 to 18
year olds and you've got to have six months to a year's
experience ( yeap well) now how is a 16 to 18 year old supposed to
get a year's experience if he's just left school.
PX: Yeah well let me eay two or three things about that... I
think it's fairly clear that if you were an employer your
preference, if you had all other things being equal, you'd prefer
to have someone who did have some experience. I think that's
understandable so the second thing I'd say is that what we've
been doing over some period of time now in Government is to
establish a range of programmes which are calcualted to give
people like yourself experience either directly under subsidised
schemes or in other ways of the work environment so that you
won't just be going as it were, cold to employers. Now what I
suggest, without going through the range of schemes, we can talk
about JOBSTART and the Australian traineeship System for
example, but what I suggest you do is that you talk closely with
the people in the CE5 so that they can tell you the range of
programmes that are available and you'll find that there is a
number of these programmes available, calculated to try to give
you experience in one way or another so that you will meet this
reasonably understandable approach that employers have. The other
thing that I want to say generally is that what we've tried to do
since we've been in government the last six years is to get
young people to stay in the education sytem longer because it-is
the case that the more education and training that you have the
better equipped you're going to be to get into the workforce and
I Just... I don't want to throw a whole lot of statistics at you
Kathy ( yep) but I just give you an example.
KATHYs But I was just thinking you know ( I can't hear you love) I
left right, I left school at year 10 and I want to do a course at
like College or that, but you've gotta pay a certain amount of
money and I live on $ 32 a week ( yeah-well) anR that's really hard
you know because I gotta pay things like board and buy my own
food or like...( yeah well if you go so how you supposed to
do a course or something to further your education and live on
say
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PM: I tell you if you go to the Department of Social Security and
the CES combined you will find the range of allowances that are
available to you to help you to do that. I mean just for example
when we came in the allowance for Secondary students from, you
know, poor incomes wasn only $ 23 a week. We've lifted that to over.
a week. There are substantial financial assistance programmes
available to help people stay in the education system and I
suggest to you that you go and talk with the Department of Social
Security representatives as well as talking to the CBS so that
you know exactly the range of programmues that are available to
them, they've been very, very greatly expanded to meet
circumstances like the ones you're talking about Kathy.
KROHNo Kathy I'm afraid we're going to have to leave it there
we're running out of time. we do have a lot of callers. Thanks
very much and our next caller, Greg. You're through to the Prime
minister Greg. Go ahead Greg.
GREG& Morning Bob ( what's the name, Greg is it Yes Greg.
There's just a couple of little queries that I'd like to sort of
query with you.( Sure) One of them is the amount the Chief
Minister gets paid up here ( yep) for a start, now whether it's
exactly true I'm told that he gets paid more than you. Now
wouldn't it be better him getting paid a little less and spending
the money in other places instead of spending it on a Chief
Minister, you know?
PM: Greg, I don't know what the Chief Minister gets paid. I
remember seeing some reference somewhere that seemed to suggest
he gets paid more than me, I don't know whether he does but what
we've done is to exercise a fair bit of restraint in regard to
salaries of Federal Members ( right) and Ministers because we took
the view that it was pretty hard to be asking ordinary workers to
exercise the pay restraint that they had and be giving ourselves
big increases so we have lagged behind a bit. But that doesn't
worry me, I think that that'. something we ought to do if we are
going to ask the community generally to exercise restraint..
GREG a The other small query is this Parliament building that
they're building up here now, well I was born and bred up here
and grown up here and I think that the money could have been
better well spent in other areas of the community instead of
spending x amount of dollars building a nice big flash parliament
building for them to be in and while you've got poor-people
living on the poverty you know.
PM: Yeah well you know, that's a matter in the end that the
people of the Northern Territory are going to have to make a
decision about and I don't pretend, Greg,-to know the details
of what they're spending on it or just how magnificent it is but
let me honestly talk about the building of Parliament houses
because it has been a bipartisan thing in the Australian,,
the Federal Parliament.
It started under my predecessor, Malcolm Fraser and we've
carried on. We've spent a lot of money in building a new Federal
Parliament House and I've got to say that meeting people from all
around Australia, that have come there and who are talking. about
it that they are in favour of the building of this new Par1iuament
House in Canberra. They see it as a national building of which
they are propud and I suppose it could have been argued in regard
to the Federal Parliament that we could have spent loe, instead
of on other things but r think you've got to remember, I guess to
some extent this is true about up here although I don't know how
grand it is, it's true that the money that's been spent on the
Federal House is something that's got to be looked at in terms of
lasting over hundreds of years. This new Parliament House is
going to last generation after generation after generation of
Australians and I think it has to be looked at in that way. Now
having said that I can't speak with authority Greg on what's
being done up here, I just don't know the details of it.
RROHNo Thank you Greg we'll have to leave it there we're running
desperately short of time. ' Tom you're through to the Prime
Minister, away you go Tom.
PM: Yes Tom.
TOMs Yes, ah, good morning I'd like to talk to you Bob ( KROHNt
Have you got a radio on TOM yes we have. ( You must turn it
off) I'd like to just talk to you breifly about the BTHC
Programme and how it's affecting the Buffalo Industry up here.
I'm sure you're familiar with the BTEC Programme but for the
listeners I'd like to briefly recap.
KROHNs Well we can't do that I'm afraid. I think most of us are
aware of the BTEC Programme. Could you put your point to the
Prime minister Tom, we haven't got time.
TOM: Ok then Bob, the Buffalo industry ( Yes I know the industry
OK has had a significant input into the Territory and the
Australian economy ( yep) in quite a few million dollars worth of
export earnings over a number of years ( yep). The Buffalo
Industry has been caught up in this cattle campaign to eradicate
the diseases. -The important points now are breifly that the
buffalo industry is all but decimated at the present time and is
likely to be decimated by 1992. The buffalo are severely
disadvantaged by the programme inasmuch as the buffalo have
nothing to gain from the programme, the programme was designed to
protect the Aust. cattle industry and inasmuch as we are likely
to be decimated by the programme I would like, if we could, and I
realise this is highly irregular, to ask if we could have a
meeting, the Buffalo industry, could hiave a meeting with
yourself and/ or John Kerin prior to a very important National
BTEC Committee meeting coming up on the twelfth and thirteenth of
April?
PM: Wel. l 1 wouldnt.. what I can do Tom is to, when I return to
Canberra, indicate that you' ve spoken to me and see if there's
any opportunity of your people.., that's the Northern Territory
Buffalo industry Council isn't it ( That's right) I'm aware of
your business and your concerns. I'll mention to John Kerin-that
you've spoken to me and see if there's any chance of you talking
with him before then...* we are contributing very large amounts to
the programme. We're contributing 20% of the $ 167 m budget for
the BTEC nationwide, that's over the four years from 1988 to 1992
and that $ 56m of that is budgetted to the Northern Territory
and, as you know the main incentive is to continue the campaign,
in to protect the export market access for Australian beef. Now I
understand what you are saying in respect to the buffalo industry
and I repeat I won't have the opportunity of meeting with your
council myself but I -will convey your concern to John Kerin and
ask that he speak with you.
TOM: I believe Bob that John Kerin is due in the Territory in a
short while ( What within the next few days is he No sorry,
within the next, I think, four weeks.
PH& Y'eah well I'll speak to John and ask that he hear what you've
got to say. ( OR, very good)
KROHN: Just before you go Mr Prime Minister I know that you're...
you have to hurry away. Can I get your impression of your vision
for the Northern Territory for the future.
PM: Yeah, well you ask, Col, my vision for the Northern
Territory. I want to say this. Your listeners just don't have to
depend upon a politician now uttering a few fine words. I just
ask them to look at the record since we've been in. And in six
years we've taken the view that the Northern Territory is a very
important part of Australia in not only terms of its own
population but its importance for these reasons. 1. It has a
very great strategic significiance and. we are daily giving
evidence to the people of the Northern Territory of our
commitment to ensuring that in the effective defence of Australia
that the Northern Territory is going to be playing an important
role, hence the expenditure of such enormous amounts of money
including for example the $ 230 odd million in the first stage of
Tindal which is going to be added to significantly in the second
stage. We are spending money up here in a way which is not only
protecting the defence and strategic interests of Australia but
is boosting the Northern Territory economy. Secondly we recognise
the importance for the future of the Territory and of Australia
of tourism and so we are both protecting the environment of the
Territory in a way which will mean increasingly tens of thousands
of other Australians and overseas visitors wfll be coming here to
see the natural wonders of the Territory and in so doing, boost
your economy,, and providing facilities, additional facilities as
I've just announced, the road funding for the Olgas...
we see the Territory as a very important part of the total
Australian economy and we will continue to make sure that in the
relevant areas where we can directly be of assistance we will* We
understand, and I think you people understand in the Territory,
that we can't just be giving, handing out money in general terms
in excessive ways by way of grants to the Territories but in the
process of adjusting the financial relationship I think even-our
political opponents in the Government up here will acknowledge
that at the last Premiers Conference we agreed to make special
arrangements to help the phasing in of the new situation.
Currently those discussions are still going on in the lead-up to
the next Premiers conference and Loan Council meeting and I can
assure the listeners, your listeners and the people of the
Northern Territory, that we'll continue to take into account the
special features of life in the Northern Territory and do what we
have done in particular areas to ensure that the strengths that
you have here are going to be added to and the particular
interests and concerns that you have are protected.
KROHiNt Mr Hawke,, just one more brief question. With the departure
of Mr Punch in NSW f rom your ministry you said that you have a
lot of talent to choose from ( yes). Does that talent include a
likely Minister from the Northern Territory, Senator Bob Collins
or M~ r Warren Snowdon
PM: They are two blokes, in my judgment, of outstanding talent.
Neither of them would expect that they would be filling the
vacancy on this occasion, but in regard to each of them, by the
record they've established, not merely in advancing vigorously
the interests of the Northern Territory, but in the general
contribution they make in the Parliament and in the Party, they
each have legitimate expectations in the future of reaching
ministerial ranks. Either of them would be a valuable addition to
the Ministry.
0 KXROIINs Mr Prime Minister thank you very much for your time.
PM: Thank you very much indeed Col to you and to your listeners.
ends