621080 A
TRANS CR IPT OF TELEV1S ION iv: v cV u~
TH E Pci HON. 1I1A IIG1TE. S OHj CTjfjA~ qL 7~ PER~ TH
Oi'l 30OTH 192
Merizies A, A. MY-, Menzies -v~ ji; dA. d you find it necesasry to r'ack
ry 1_ t4er 4* 0
1tell. the roasons WerTe indicated in le0tey toh
and ackno-i.: ledgcd by him and those have bCeen pub. ished,'
M. L' 0Bury is a ;! an of abiit~ ry,~ c'n-aracter and i value
himvmeru h ad i ', sn ' in easy thing to find
myself reachiing thle i-nevit-able decision that 1I must
ask him to rsg bL. afte: z al, lhe hiad state ne
twice, and reaffirmcae it9 v ' iews a bout the Comm1on
Maricet2 about the effect of-" B: idtish entry cn the
Austral ian a ooywhi oh were iaterially different
from the se iihich nad. been expreojsed on beha'_ lf-of the
Governme~ nt by myself and. McEwan, an~ d that was not
a pcositi'.-on -thiat I could acce-pt because these ne-, otiati.
ons are in mid-troam, so to speak, at the present
te2reachitng perliaps ve]-y critical stages and, to
have w-ihat would be treated as a Government view w'iich
ran across the vicws that had been put by Mxr, McExfen
and myself, was not acouot'ahle0 And, therefore,
unqa ppily, Hr0 B-ary had to go.
Do you thins[ iirt Mr., Bury~ s statement bas alr. eady
been damaging to Australia case abr.-oad?
W03-11 it could be u,, ed aiainst Aust-. F-ilia's case, but
the action that htas beo,, n ta u4ou id demons-rrate that
it is no--t t'he . fustxa'LJ. cn CGovecaeintvS view and,.
therefo-e, 1. drjn'r. myscl-f expect that1 our posi. tion
will, as from no> v beo weiakened0
Mr. Bury said thCll Cormn -cn .~ oktwould have a limited
Lind minor-eff-ctu upon AustICra-lia. is there any truth
at all. in theSE VJ. 0Ws'?
I don't agaree with tiem, 0 L espectMr Bury's belief
that tacy ,, ro true, but 1 thinkY that if Great . Eh-tain,
for exnnple., wer3e to go intGo the Common Market
un-onditionally, th-CO; is say, on the10 terms of the
Trety f Relike the othe uropean countanles, the
impact on our economy uouLd be vc; rcy substanLiai-
Generally, do you cesd~-t;[ he Butry affair.-a li-ttle
local difficu.-lty or a; major Party crisis?
Oh, the_-e's-no maJor ar-crisiTs about i Theire,
has been an attemm,, t Jn the_ Ea_-strn States in someo
newspapers to i.! Iip it up inoa Party, cr. isis. in
fact. tiie-y hiave hoen, in sC-fliC sections of thae Sydney
press, indust',, ri. ousl-y tr" ying to ereot'e theo idea that
I was p-asted -into-z asking for Mr., Bury's resignation
by Ilr, MeE',, 7n; the facts ooefi ngc. o, urs, thlat o-" er:
the oer id ~ woday, Ihad tw-o conversations with
Mr. McE-ien, boi. h' on 11. h-. e t~ ephc.--ne, a+ Lid both ini: UtJa'tod
by me. One was 1-' o navc vjord with him about issuing
statements Lo and 1 arid thei etheir cne was ihen
had consideread tho pos-ition of--Mr, Bury. and * r had had
ong -tal~ k with i~ ILOd with. one or toof my ctftor
colleaws-es wh a7. a1i: Lab2o, 2 then -rang up Mr.
Mciluen to, saCy . L0oy ok t sioar~ r y, but I see no
c; s cape_ from ask rres), iusccrp a Ca n you1 .
think'a eñ any, a 1 ti I C I i n 1 t, was iook-Lng
f o no., And. 1 ho saird t. l-at ho_ hLad ' boor. thinking about-
1t ho, 1-as r. eedd as was, and that Lo had not
bec--7 -ob le aorn ' c ioernc::!,., j. xe U2.., I an. at,.
Q. Is this the first time that you have had to sack a
Minister? Oh, no. But let the dead past bury its deado
Qo Who will replace Mr, Bury?
A, I don't know. I will begin to Uhink about that problem
when I get back home.
Q, Do you think Fred Chaney has got a chance of selection?
A, No, look, i am not going to discuss names, thank you.
Q. In Wollongong recently, when referring to Britain's
proposed entry into the Market, you were quoted as
H saying and I quote, " We stress the need to meet the
new era of trade as a challenge and it must not be
exaggerated into a disaster," Is this a softening
down of your own statements made earlier and mo; e in
line with Mr. Bury's?
Ao None whatever. If you were to read the full text
my speech at Wollongong you would see that it stands
exactly on the same footing as the first statement I
made on this matter and all the ones I have made since,
Qo Was it true that you had to paint a grim picture abroad
to obtain the best terms for Australia and paint a rosy
picture here to retain confidence in industry and
business and boost development?
A, I hope I haven't sunk to that political level, When I
do, people ought to throw me out,
Qo , s it t;--ue 9Mr, Menzies that Australia's position has
improved recently as the result of the œ 127M C-ATT
negotiations between Australia and the Six?
Ao Oh, well, there are some improvements there, but they
are not connected with the Common Market discussions.
There is a process that goes on in GATT quite regularly
in which concessions arc made here or there in exchange
for other concessions, There is a lot of tariff
negotiation that goes on in GlAT,' but that's not the
problem that arises in the Common Market discussions.
The Common Market discussions will determine whether
our preferences inside the Commonwealth, the preferential
pattern of Commonwcalth trade is to continue, or if it
continues, for how long, or on what terms. There is a
great misunderstanding about the position of Australia
on this thing. We have not been overpainting our
picture. We have in fact from the very beginning,
approached the problem constructively, We have had our
officials in discussion with the officials in Great
Britain over the period of a year now, Mro McEwon
has been there, I've been there. On each possible
level, we have presented our views, and all the time,
we've been looking for some process, some agreement
that will maintain to a reascnablo extent our trading
position; though it may not involve the maintenance
in all their original qualities of our preferences,
We have been looking for a middle course of a helful
kind, and I think that anybody in the United Kingdom ooo.../ 3
X This is not a direct quotation from the Prime
Minister s Wollon-nong speech,
team would agtce th* no ccuntry ha,-s bFan so cons tructlv3,
thlough. we have; I admit, been . rsistent i~ n the no
that we havcn~ t take1 ou-, teeth ou" of this mattgrs,
Day by day, weed: by week, we Lave been pressing cer-tain
views thiat we hold. And thea effect of this ha-i yet to
be seen.* The Si-' c may modify some of thieir ruiles in
order to accommodate Cc'mmcnweath. tv'ade:,, We don~ t know,,
Q. Are you hopeful that Britain wrill or won~ t join the
Common Market?
A, That depends entiroli, on thie terms. You see, the
political advantages that Great Britain seeos in joining
the Common Market well, they are matters for the
British Govorment ' to determ. 1ne0 We -, rc not deciding
th. at proble%, ThIey are,, The ecenomic consideratioils
about joining the Coizqon Markiet stan.,, d in a different
and -it is on those that we have been rresenting
our views riots once more,) to prevent Great Bri c( ain from
making her own decision thatts not our., idea at all
but to secure9 th1-rough her, as good a deal-from thie
countries of th1-e Six as we Can in the interests of our
own export trade,, Of course, if we did not do tt~,
we would be : railing in cur dUty to th . e pople of
Australia, How do you interpret the weekcnd news of a deadlock
between the negctinators?
A, I flavor make an-, y comment on something that I read in
a weekend paper, honcstly; il' wait until I hear
ofcially as -to iwhIat has gone cn, Iwul o
readily accept thc idea t~ hat there is a deadlock.,
I think you will fl: nd th, they wi'll be talking again
i~ n the course o-f* tl-e next few days., And they are
bound to, Both si'des at,-c going to exh-aust thle
poss2. bl. itJ. es before tht-ey aclnovrldge that they can't
get anywhiere0
Q Prime Minister, are you worried about Australia's
unemp1 cyrueii s ituation?
Al No9 thaere is more thian I 1, lculd like,, but if ycu mean
by that do I regard this as being a rncssive, continuing
problem. no, I don't thin]: that, Our idea is that
you must got tile prosent number of peop-Le applying,
re gisatered for emplocyment, substantially dovn,
Everybody would agree about that. And we have some
hopes7 considerable hopes, that as a result of the
general economic irrprovement these niumrbers will fa-'?
and fall during the cou. e ol' this year,,
Theore is a noticeable drop since Do(-ewbrfs :' ecorO.,,
A, 0h, yes, Quite noticeablec and. that is all the more
remarkable because ze had a record intakeo schoolleavers
and so en 7i Novrember, DeCember, January,
The probl. em, in other ors; of finding employment was
inuchi bigger than it had been on any previous occasion,
and yet the imp~ rovement as you knew during the last
faw months has beericiitc rernarkat-. 1. o.
Q. ~ ThLere were still 93, 000 uanemployed in June doe~ s
this mean the oconcmmic reco~ very mes2ures, yrou. took
earlier are notvokngqut ao well. as you would
like? 0 0 C0 0 00 C/' 4
As It may be that we have yet to see their full result,
We had discussions with a number of business ana other
people to see what their impress. ions were,, I think we
all agreed that the measures are working, that the state
of the economy is improving, but that everybody would
l. ike to see it improve more rapidly. in other words,
it is going in the right direction, but we have yet to
see the full effect of some of the measures that were
t. ker. You want to remember that measures taken in
Febxuary have not had a very long time to produce their
results, Already they have produced some very interesting
ones,
Qo What bearing will the unemployment situation have on the
new Budget?
A, I don't know that I follow that question, The new
Budget will state the economic policy of the Government
so far as it relates to financial measures and in framing
a Budget, you take into account a series of problems
affecting the national economy including the necessity
to improve the employment situation. It is one of the
factors that is taken into account,
Q. The Federal Government did ask the WoAo Government for
details of the development programmes in the North-' Iest.
Is this significant? Does it mean that there will be
help for the North-West?
Ao Look, I beg to be excused from saying anything myself,
officially, about t. his matter0 The fact is that one
of the Wes., Australian Ministors, Mr, Court, has just
been in Canberra having discussions with our people
about some of these developmental ideas and I believe
they have boon making very satisfactory progress.
I had a talk thi. s morning with your distinguished
Premier here, Mr, Brand and Mro Brand himself seemed
quite optimistic about the way these discussions were
goingo I nave not been conducting them myself.
Qo Why isn't your Party contesting the Batman seat in
Victoria, Mr. Menzies?
A, Well, now, I wonder if you would tell me why you think
we should? It costs money, you know, to contest a
by-election, My Party always has less money to spend
than the Labor Partyo That is not very well known, but
it is trueo To run a candidate for a seat that you are
not going to win and which is going to be materially
altered against you in the forthcoming redistribution
and with no Senate vote to concern yourself with all
those things didn't add up in my mind to a good case
for putting up a candidate going through this form.
Nor did it commend itself to the Fxecutive of the Pr. rty
organisation in Victoria, whose opinion I, in fact,
confirm, and they decided not to run a candidate0
Qo How do you think your Party would go if there
is a new election?
Ae I haven't a clue.
Qo Sir, would you tell me what is going to become of
either Mr, Hasluck or Mr, Chaney now that the Perth and
Curtin seats have been merged? o00 0C0C a/
A0 I ~ don't 1: now. 1 will be very Ln, p Idnthv
both of them still with mc afe th citiUt
oeats have been th1rough an election~ woul. d be vey
disappointed0 iBut., * Lok), d on?+. a': k me about thiose
things. I am not familiar with tte boundaries bhere0
I don't know what is going to happen, Nor doev
anybody else at the present tinle, I would think
QO The United Nations Mission to Australian New Guin~ ea
was high in its praise for Autralials administration,
' out what are you going to do abouat their Sugesio
for an enlarged and maore represontativo Parliament2
A ' dell, I think you are putcing their recommendation
ipn rttymodrae way when you say that Itoght
they were snying thiat there ought to bc full Parliarentary
Government establish'ed almdost instant~ y, within a year
or two,, Now, that 1, jst doesn'~ t make sense, quite
fOrankly0We have been developing, under the cdoministration
of Mr. FHasluck himself, who iaas done a wonderful
job in relation to Now Guinea; we have been developing
Local Governmaent. There are quito, a niudiber of 1oc&. l
author ities now in whicli tae indigenous inhabitants are
membcrs and conduct the0ir operations. We now have
them on the Lagislat1ive Council, 0 But anybody who knows
anything about New Guilnea withl-ij'Vs hundreds of different
languages and its area and its population many of them
remote and living in a ver_-y primitive staze anybody
who supposes -that you can 1hand cver self -government to
that community cut of hnand has not learned the lessons
of the Congo, tha-t is all I can cay0 We have a great
responsibility for Now~ Guinea, and our responsibility
is to bring up the standard of living and the capacity
for se]. f-gove:. rurent of t, people there, and we propose
to dischiarge thiat roSpOriSibility. It would be a criminal
act on our part to abandon i~ t
QO Do you tlihink theire is a discrepancy between the UN0
Miss. Jon's p-ressure on behalf of th-e Papuans? political
advanceme(-nt i~ n Australian New Guinea in view of what
is going on in West New Guineali
A0 Oh., well, I am not going -to discuss that.
Q. ~ Well, finally M-r10 Menzies, I would like-_ to ask you this.
There have been for many years people often asking the
question " When will Mr. Menzies ro-tire?" Have you
got any plans for retirement?.
A, ~ Dear me, I have frequently [, ad plans for reti re-ment
and -then something happens, that makes it imnpossible0
So here 1 am, chained to the wheel8 I can throw no
more lig-ht on m-y fUr t ha n tha t,
Qn W'ell. I'd like to thank you fo--r coming along tonight,
Mr,, rire Minister. Thank you and good night,~