PR~ ESS OFFICE TRANSCRIPT 2 ERAY17
MR. NIXON INTERVIEWED: MINISTERIAL TRAVEL
FROM ABC'S " NATIONWIDE" ( 23/ 2/ 79)
There was a short debate in the Parliament tonight on, as it was
put, the extravagant costs of Ministerial travel. A lot of
mud was thrown by the Opposition, but the Government could hardly
complain they were equally eager to employ the same tactics
when they had the opportunity.
Shadow Transport Minister, Mr. Peter Morris, the man who threw
the mud today, is in Canberra with Richard Carlton, together
with the man who was his target, Mr. Peter Nixon.
Richard Carlton:
Before continuing with this story, can I re-confirm the
news flash that James Dibble brought to you in the news bulletin
a moment ago that the 12th ranking Minister in the Fraser
Ministry, the Minister for Finance, the Member for MacPherson,
the Gold Coast seat in Queensland, Mr. Eric Robinson has
resigned from the Ministry. As I understand, Mr. Robinson
submitted a three-page letter to Mr. Fraser this evening at
8: 00 o'clock. What was in the letter, what the issue is, I
have no idea. The Prime Minister's Office is refusing to make
any comment whatsoever. Mr. Robinson, it may be known to some,
was a very colleague of Mr. Fraser's, he possible still is
but he was associated with the 1974 attempt by Mr. Fraser to
wrest the leadership of the Liberal Party from Mr. Snedd~ n and
he was associated also with the very successful 1975 attempt
by Mr. Fraser to wrest the leadership from Mr. Snedden on that
occasi. cn. I have no more information on that story. I can
confirm the accuracy of it though, and if I may, Mr. Nixon,
I did not ask you here on the pretext obviously, of asking you
about Mr. Robinson's resignation, but can you add anything
to what I said.
Mr. Nixon:
No I can't. It comes as a complete surprise to me. Mr. Robinson
has been a very valued colleague both to myself and Mr. Fraser,
of course, and I think only time will tell whether it's some
personal reason or whatever that has caused him to resign.
He has taken me by surprise.
Richard Carlton:
Mr. Morris,
this is not related, I suggest to the pretext on which I invited
you into the studio this evening either, but do you know anytLhing
about Mr. Robinson's resignation?
Mr. Morris:
No, it's come as a total surprise to me also. / 2
23 FEBRUARY 1979
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Richard Carlton:
May we now revert to the pre-plan: VIP aircraft. Your speech
in the Parliament today, as Clyde, suggested, throwing a little
mud, sir, is there anything about the Government's use of
VIP privileges anything, any improper use of those
privileges that the Whitlam Government was not also guilty
of in its term in office.
Mr. Morris:
Let's put the matter in context. It was Mr. Fraser who said
in 1975 there would be no more international safaris. We didn't
want a tourist for a Prime Minister. What I was pointing this
afternoon, in spite of that statement, we've got a tourist
for a Prime Minister, whether we like it or not, and a tourist
that we can't afford. The thing that the Whitlam Government
didn't do was it didn't embark on any $ 40 million programme
that we are to re-equip the VIP flight. That's the essential
difference and that was the point of this afternoon's debate.
The Government's decision, in the initial stages, has been
$ 14 1/ 2 billion in the purchase of two Boeing 707' s. It is
a direct contradiction and rejection of what Mr. Fraser said
in 1975.
Mr. Nixon:
As a simple answer to this of course, circumstances since 1975
have changed markedly. We've had a report from Sir Robert Mark,
who is the Head of Scotland Yard and that's one of the reports
on security and the need for . Prime Ministers when travelling
to travel in VIP planes to separate him from the travelling
public. For two reasons: there is a tremendous trust involved
in providing security when a Prime Minister or Head of State of
any country, in a host country, travels with the normal travelling
public in commercial planes.
Richard Carlton:
Doesn't that same thing apply to Mr. Whitlam though, in his
days as Prime Minister.
Mr. Nixon:
Well the security question certainly was not raised and I don't
think even Mr. Whitlam pretended that his use of a Boeing 707,
which he ripped offQantas over a busy Christmas period, was on
the basis of security.... . No I never suggested. that, but the
reason -for the purchase of the 707s is certainly VIP use. But
equally importantly, and perhaps more importantly, they are the
last two planes that Qantas own the 707s aircraft the RAAF
have been using those to charter their people and their traffic
up to Butterworth. They will no longer be available after they
are sold. They now have them in their fleet and they will be
used importantly by the RAAF in the majority of hours used and
importantly by the Prime Minister in the minority of hours used
as VIP fleet.
Mr . Morris:
Mr. Nixon has a faulty memory. Mr. Whitlam, in response to
Mr. Nixon's own questions on the chartering of the 707 made that
-essential point that security was involved, but the point
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Mr. Morris: ( continued)
I want to stress is that the Government has no recommendation
from it, from any responsible quarter that it should purchase
Boeing 707s and a veritable flying hotel. There is no
recommendation at all for Governments that they should buy
707s. That's the essential point of the discussion.
Richard Canlton:
Do you think that the dispute here would really disappear
if the Opposition was given equal access to the planes?
Mr. Morris:
Not at all.
Richard Carlton:
It is a matter of principle?
Mr. Morris:
It is a matter of priority. We see that we have a time now
of record unemployment. We are in a period of enforced
economic adversity. Yesterday, last evening in particular,
we saw the Government reject a : proposal to restore six-montly
cost of living adjust2ent to pensioners. We've seen a cut in
defence service allocation only today the Prime Minister told
the Par-liament of the increasing crisis to the north. What has
been the Government's response?
Mr. Nixon:
Are you saying that Mr. Hayden won't use the VIPs?
Mr. Morris:
I can't speak for Mr. Hayden.
Mr. Nixon:
Well, what are you saying. Are you saying that..
Mr. Morris:
I'm not saying that we wouldn't purchase Boeing 707s...
Mr. Nixon:
You know you will have access to them, don't you? But irrespective
of that, the fact is that there was a report by Sir Robert Mark,
who is a former Head of Scotland Yard. There is a report by
an IDC. There are requests by Heads of by other Governments
that when the Prime Minister of Australia travels in their
country that he doesn't it in VIP aircraft for security purposes.
I think the reality is we are living in changed circumstances
and we shouldn't ignore it. When you combine that factor with
the use that the RAAF can make of these planes, it is just
quite wrong to make the bald statement that he'd done this, and
that he's not prepared to do something for pensioners. The fact
it was taking the total decision, it was taking the total needs / 4
4
Mr. Nixon: ( continued)
of RAAF requirements and they will get more use out of the
plane than the VIP fleet will.
Mr. Morris
Isn't it rather incongruous that the day the Prime Minister
announces to the Parliament the danger to the north, 20 of
our new tanks are in moth-balls, 20 percent of the army's
armoured vehicles withdrawn from service. The Navy steaming
time is cut, ammunition issues have been cut, yet we can
squander, and that's the only word to describe it, we can
squander, $ 14 1/ 2 million to buy two VIPs two Boeing flying
hotels. Now that's $ 14 1/ 2 million. If that was used for
defence purposes, would produce a ten percent increase ( inaudible)
Mr. Nixon:
They will be used for ( inaudible) purposes quite heavily. And
as time unfolds and as the planes are put into use, we will be
able to see the hours they are used by the RAAF. It is one
of their priorities to have them. 000---