PRIME MINISTER:
Can I start by wishing Ian Thorpe well for the future. His retirement is an enormous loss for Australian swimming, but it's tough. He started early, all swimmers do. Millions of Australians will remember his wonderful individual performances. I remember a wonderful performance of his in the relay at the 2000 Olympic Games, but like so many other Australians, there have been so many great performances that they do all tend to merge into a recollection of a remarkable athlete, a great swimmer, a good bloke and I wish him every success and happiness in the years ahead.
JOURNALIST:
Prime Minister the Switkowski report has come down. What sort of carbon price signal do you think there will need to be to enable nuclear power to be a realistic option in Australia?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well the most important thing is that we have a proper debate about climate change and that proper debate must include a root and branch consideration of the contribution that nuclear power can make. It's quite unrealistic to talk about fighting the problem of greenhouse gas emissions unless you are open minded and progressive and forward looking enough to look at each and every available alternative. There is no one single solution to the problem of climate change. You need every weapon in the armoury and one of them, of course, is obviously nuclear power. To what extent and at what time will depend on a number of things. At the moment nuclear power is dearer than dirty coal, if I can put it that way, but as time goes by and clean coal technology even in the most optimistic of circumstances adds somewhat to the cost of using coal then nuclear power comes very much into the equation.
JOURNALIST:
Prime Minister, do you think it is realistic as Dr Switkowski clearly does to suggest Australia could have 25 nuclear power stations by 2050 providing around about one third of Australia's electricity needs?
PRIME MINISTER:
I have no doubt that if we have a proper examination of this issue and we don't approach it in a prejudiced fashion, nuclear power does come into the equation. It's too early for me as the leader of the Government to start speculating about particular numbers by particular dates, but the economics are obvious and compelling and they are very much that right at the moment, if we go on using the fossil fuels that we have and we don't do anything to reduce the greenhouse gas emission impacts of them, well coal remains the cheapest source. But if we're worried about climate change, then we have to bring about some reduction in the greenhouse emitting properties of coal and once you start doing that you add to the cost of its use and that then brings nuclear into the equation. That's the simple proposition.
JOURNALIST:
So it's clearly a long term threat to the Australian coal industry. There is no way out of that is there?
PRIME MINISTER:
I don't think the way the world is growing that it's implausible for both of them to have a role. I think the Australian coal industry has a guaranteed place in the future of the Australian economy. My approach will protect the coal industry, the approach of others will undermine it because they see the coal industry as the cause of the problem. I see the coal industry as part of the solution, as I see nuclear power, as I see renewables. We've got to be broad-minded enough to look at all of them and it's the Labor Party and the Greens who are against looking at nuclear power.
JOURNALIST:
Quite clearly, whether or not Australia does go nuclear, Australians are going to be facing much heftier bills for their energy aren't they? One way or another?
PRIME MINISTER:
Oh I don't think reducing the impact of greenhouse gas emissions will be costless. There's no point in pretending that there won't be some additional cost involved. But we've got to make certain that that cost doesn't fall unfairly and disproportionately on the industries that give us a natural advantage. And I share the worry of the coal industry and some of the coal miners in the Hunter for example, that the policies of the Greens and the left wing of the Labor Party pose a direct threat to the coal industry.
JOURNALIST:
So Prime Minister are you waiting for more information on nuclear before you come up with a detailed policy before the next election?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well we've just got Dr Switkowski's draft report. Let's have a debate about that, let the peer review group under the Chief Scientist, Dr Peacock, examine the draft report. I understand Dr Switkowski will deliver his final report before Christmas. We then need a lengthy community debate; it's too early to jump to the next step. This is a very rapid movement already. I think public opinion is shifting on nuclear power but I want to take the public with me. I'm not trying to force it down the throat of the public, I want people to understand what's involved. We're talking about a debate that is going to go on for some time. We can't expect instant policy gratification. We have to do this in a measured way but look at where we've moved from in the space of a few months. The beginning of this year nobody was talking about having a debate on nuclear power in this country, or very few people, and I think we've come a long way. I think the public's interested, I think the public will listen to the debate, I don't think they have the prejudice against nuclear power that Mr Beazley and Bob Brown have. I mean, Senator Brown and Mr Beazley have a prejudice about nuclear power; I'm open minded about nuclear power.
JOURNALIST:
Prime Minister, why are you going to Malaysia next week?
PRIME MINISTER:
Because it's important in the bilateral relationship that I return the visit that Dr Badawi paid to Australia last year. I'll be gone for a day and a half. It's very important that we keep watering the plants, if I can put it that way, in these bilateral relationships in Asia and one of the convenient things about our position with the Asia-Pacific region is that you can do very quick trips. I think I'm leaving on Wednesday afternoon and I'll be back Friday night. It's a very good way of keeping in touch.
JOURNALIST:
Prime Minister, to take the public with you on the nuclear issue as you desire, you're going to have to satisfy them that there'll be a reasonable process for determining where nuclear power stations will be. How do you see that process?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I think, Mark, the first thing to do is to have a general debate about the generic benefits of nuclear power, to have a general debate about the pluses and minuses, the economics, the safety, the export potential, the relationship between Australia and international treaty obligations, all of those things. If we are to have a nuclear power industry in this country we need to change the law because the law doesn't permit it at the present time. So there are a lot of those generic things and then obviously the question of the location of any power stations will follow commercial decisions. The Government won't be nominating where nuclear power stations might go if we decide to have them, but obviously like any other investment you'll need to have a commercial driver for a nuclear power plant or station to be built. But we are a considerable time away from that. I think we have to do these things in an orderly fashion.
JOURNALIST:
On the economics of it, do you accept that there would have to be some kind of a carbon price signal to make nuclear power economically viable?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well at the moment dirty coal is cheaper than nuclear power, I've said that, I mean, self evidently while that remains the case then there's no need for nuclear power. We have enormous reserves of coal, fossil fuels and it's quite cheap to use and that's the cheapest source of electricity generation, but I thought everybody was in favour of reducing greenhouse gas emissions and if you're going to reduce greenhouse gas emissions, even things like clean coal technology will make the use of coal a bit more expensive.
JOURNALIST:
You said you think public sentiment is shifting?
PRIME MINISTER:
I think it's shifting, but I'm not saying it's going to shift...
JOURNALIST:
There is still a little bit of a NIMBY sentiment isn't there on the question of where reactors would go, not in my backyard. How do you respond to that?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well there's a NIMBY sentiment about everything. I thought I detected a NIMBY sentiment in some of the coastal areas of Victoria regarding windmills. I thought I detected a NIMBY sentiment about power stations in different parts of Australia. Nobody likes something being built near them and these things are never easy, but the scientific evidence that I've heard of and seen in recent times tells me that in reality, nuclear power stations are less dangerous than many coal-fired power stations or gas-fired operations. So I think you're always going to have a reservation about something being built near you. But look I am not underestimating all of these challenges but the world is saying isn't it, and isn't the Australian public saying, is they want a genuine addressing of this issue of climate change. Now what I am saying if you are genuine, if you are fair dinkum about addressing the problem of climate change you've got to consider everything, and I don't pretend it will be easy, I don't pretend it will be popular, but the alternative of doing nothing is an alternative that I don't think the Australian public wants. I think the Australian public wants the Government to take a measured, balanced response. I don't think they believe all of the doomsday scenarios for a moment, but on the other hand they are worried that there is something in it and I think they are right. I think there is enough evidence to suggest we, at the very least, should take precautionary measures, that means looking at alternatives to existing fossil fuel use, that means clean coal technology, it means looking at nuclear, it means looking at renewables at the margin because renewables will never operate base load...produce base load power...
JOURNALIST:
Prime Minister...
PRIME MINISTER:
You can't replace power stations with renewables.
JOURNALIST:
Why would the coal industry take up clean coal technology unless there is some sort of compulsion under a carbon-trading scheme or taxpayer assistance?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well right at the moment, of course, we are giving taxpayer assistance to develop some of the technologies. Now I have established a taskforce to have a look at the shape that a global trading, emissions trading system might take and I will be releasing the terms of reference and the personnel on that group shortly, and that's part of the process. But I can't give you all of the answers now because it's too early in the debate, but I can tell you part of the answer has to be a full consideration of nuclear power.
JOURNALIST:
Prime Minister, the AWB report comes out on Friday is that going to be tabled immediately or will you wait until...?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well parliament sits next week, it will be tabled early next week.
JOURNALIST:
Just before you leave Vietnam, can I ask you do you think the Vietnam war was a mistake?
PRIME MINISTER:
I supported our involvement at the time and I don't intend to recant that. I believe that in public life you are accountable for the decisions that you take. I mean, I didn't hold any position of authority then but I supported the reasons for Australia's involvement and nothing has altered my view that at the time on the assessments that were made then I took that view and I took that view properly and I don't intend to indulge this preoccupation that many have in recanting everything that they supported when they were in positions of authority. I think in public life you take a position and I think particularly of the positions I've taken in the time I've been Prime Minister. I have to live with the consequences of those both now and into the future. And if I ever develop reservations, well I hope I would have the grace to keep them to myself because I think you take a position and you've got to live by that and be judged by it, and that's my position.
JOURNALIST:
(inaudible) still in Asia?
PRIME MINISTER:
No, no could we perhaps give Mr Lewis a go and then we'll have Mr Dobell, he's tried hard, he is relentless as well as sagacious. What's his question...
JOURNALIST:
Prime Minister, the Washington Post is reporting the US Government is considering an increase in troops to Iraq to stabilise the situation there, is that your understanding of President Bush's current thinking?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, President Bush is the person who should articulate his present and any future thinking. What I do, however, know is that the Americans are not going to precipitately leave Iraq, I've been saying that for a long time and nothing I have learnt over the last few days alters that position.
JOURNALIST:
Prime Minister, Australia's interests in South East Asia have been very well served by the very conservative approach that the ASEAN states have taken to nuclear power on all the levels. Is an Australian debate about this, particularly as the debate moves on to enrichment issues, are you worried about the optics of that in Asia, does that start to affect the ASEAN approach to nuclear issues which has served Australia very well?
PRIME MINISTER:
No I am not. I haven't detected any unease either during this visit or previously about that. I don't think that is going to be a difficulty. I think many of the Asian countries themselves see the value of nuclear power, I thought India and China were both interested in expanding their respective nuclear capacities. If you look at the entire region and I would not imagine that other countries would rule that out either.
Thank you.
[ends]