ROWE:
Good morning, Prime Minister.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning Jessica.
ROWE:
Thank you for coming in.
PRIME MINISTER:
Pleasure.
ROWE:
Prime Minister, did your Government know that bribes were being paid to Saddam Hussein's regime in exchange for wheat deals?
PRIME MINISTER:
What, by the AWB? No.
ROWE:
But what about Michael Long. He has appeared before the Cole commission, he was an Australian Government adviser, he was also an AWB employee, he has said that he passed on information to the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade about those kickbacks and he passed on that information in June 2003?
PRIME MINISTER:
Jessica, the information that he passed on did not identify AWB as paying kickbacks. You would think that that was the case from some of the headlines this morning but what he did was to pass on a general expression of concern by the Coalition Provisional Authority about the payment of bribes being involved in the overall oil-for-food program.
ROWE:
Wasn't it, though, negligent Prime Minister not to investigate those allegations, especially given the fact that at the time the AWB was the largest supplier to Iraq under the oil-for-food program? Shouldn't have those concerns been investigated?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well Jessica, they didn't in any way identify AWB, I say that again and secondly, prior to 2003, on one or two occasions, allegations had been made about AWB, they were put to AWB, and not only was the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade satisfied with AWB's response but in one particular...
ROWE:
So you were then aware of the allegations?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well there's no secret that some commercial rivals, namely the Americans and the Canadians had made allegations. This has come out in earlier evidence and they had been put to AWB and AWB all along had denied any involvement in the payment of bribes. We had no evidence, as distinct from the allegations in the first two instances of commercial rivals, we had no evidence, the Department had no evidence, that AWB was in any way involved in the payment of bribes and the reputation of AWB as the single-desk seller of Australian wheat was very high. I mean we frankly believed all along that AWB was an organisation of complete integrity.
ROWE:
What do you think now?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I'm not in a position to say because the inquiry is still going and AWB hasn't had its full day in court and until the inquiry has been completed, I'm not going to make a judgment. But I can tell you this, I did not know, my Ministers did not know and on the information that I have been provided and the advice that I have received from the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade I do not believe that the Department knew that AWB was involved in the payment of bribes.
ROWE:
You say you don't know, how do you feel as an Australian Prime Minister about these allegations that hundreds of millions of dollars was paid to Saddam Hussein's murderous regime to secure wheat sales?
PRIME MINISTER:
Jessica, if it is established, in a proper legal sense, that that occurred, well I would be very angry. It would be against all of my understanding of how that organisation operated. I mean I believed that AWB was an organisation of integrity and I notice this comment about our former ambassador going into bat for them in 2004; of course he did because he believed, as his department believed, that what was going on there was an attempt by the American wheat industry to grab our market in Iraq. Let's not get starry-eyed about American complaints.
ROWE:
Well America is concerned, I mean the Republican Senator Norm Coleman, he's heading up the US inquiry into illegal payments made to Saddam Hussein, he's saying there is a cover-up. He is very concerned.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well his letter contains a misstatement of fact. His letter actually alleges that evidence has been provided of complicity by the Government, now that's wrong, it's an inaccurate description of what's occurred at the commission. But let's not get starry-eyed about the Americans, they're going in hard to protect their commercial wheat interests. I freely admit that I worked very hard as Prime Minister, and I don't apologise for it, to make sure that Australia kept its wheat market in Iraq. That didn't involve doing anything improper or illegal but it meant that I pushed very hard.
ROWE:
But that's still under investigation though.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well my conduct's not under investigation because I haven't been involved in anything improper.
ROWE:
How do you feel about possibly widening the terms of reference of the Cole commission so it would look at the Government's possible involvement as opposed to just the AWB?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well Jessica if we are asked by the Chairman of the commission, Mr Cole, to widen the terms of reference we will immediately consider that. I am not going to say in advance what our reaction will be because I don't know whether there will be a request.
ROWE:
It is expected that he will make a statement later today.
PRIME MINISTER:
He's said he's going to make a statement, I don't know what is going to be in that statement, he's independent contrary to what the Americans have alleged. These American congressman are alleging, some of them, that Mr Cole is not independent of the Government. Now that is offensive to him and it's also offensive to the Government.
ROWE:
Now we have a very close relationship with America, both in terms of our military commitment and also you have a very close relationship with President Bush. What would you say to President Bush if he rings you up on the phone and says: John, what is going on with the Wheat Board?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well Jessica, I am pretty certain he won't do that.
ROWE:
You don't think it's likely?
PRIME MINISTER:
No I don't. I think he'd have enough sense to wait until the outcome of the inquiry, even if that were in his mind, and I don't believe it is, and he would also know that a lot of the noise being generated on Capitol Hill is noise designed by the American wheat industry to damage Australia's wheat industry's reputation in Iraq and thereby get some commercial advantage. Now that doesn't, let me say, that doesn't in any way diminish the seriousness of this issue and whilst I believe in hard bargaining in international trade, that hard bargaining does not involve and never has and never will involve the payment of bribes.
ROWE:
Moving on to some other issues now Prime Minister, in New South Wales we have a situation where two teenage girls are facing murder charges. The New South Wales Premier has said where are the parents? Do you think we have a wider problem in our society about parental control of their children?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I can't talk about that particular case you understand that.
ROWE:
Not specifically, but...
PRIME MINISTER:
More generally, yes I do I think there are many instances of criminal and other behaviour by young, very young teenagers and you are entitled to ask the question, where are the parents? Sadly some kids are brought up without any parental control, interest or authority and I think as a society we are paying a very heavy price for the philosophy of earlier years when everybody was exhorted to do their own thing without any worry about the responsibility they had to others, particularly their children.
ROWE:
COAG is meeting in Canberra next week, on the agenda is going to be mental health. Will we see any federal leadership on an issue that affects so many familles across the country?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well Jessica, I've already said I want a big focus on mental health this year. We have to work with the States. I'm not saying it's all their responsibility and I don't expect them to say...
ROWE:
Because there is often a bit of buck-passing isn't there?
PRIME MINISTER:
I hope that we can keep that to a minimum. I will, as it were, open the batting on mental health at the COAG meeting. We have a lot of other things on the agenda and I think we can make a lot of progress in some other health areas and also things relating to skills and recognition of qualifications. But I think we can, if there's good will, make a lot of progress in this area.
ROWE:
That is heartening to hear Prime Minister. Now we know you're a big cricket fan, have you got any tips of who might be winning today?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I would expect Australia to win, but I not only do that out of automatic patriotism but I do think Australia has demonstrated a tremendous superiority apart from one or two lapses. I think they've really demonstrated how strong they are.
ROWE:
Prime Minister it is lovely to see you, thank you so much for coming in.
PRIME MINISTER:
And good luck on the programme.
ROWE:
Thank you.
PRIME MINISTER:
You are obviously enjoying it.
ROWE:
I am, I am loving it.
PRIME MINISTER:
Thank you.
ROWE:
Thank you Prime Minister.
[ends]