SAUNDERS:
I have in the studio with me the Prime Minister of Australia, John Howard. Good morning to you.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning Louise.
SAUNDERS:
Welcome back to Tasmania. We will take some calls. The line is full at the moment, but if you do want to call - 1300 361 700. Mr Howard, I might start with the obvious, and that is the election date. I know that you've probably been asked once or twice before, but the election - where are you going when you leave Tasmania, Prime Minister? Are you going to Canberra or Sydney?
PRIME MINISTER:
I'm going to Canberra.
SAUNDERS:
And are you staying there all weekend?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I'm going to Canberra. I really don't have anything to add to that.
SAUNDERS:
Okay. Is this... the talk about fixed terms? Mark Latham has raised the question of perhaps we need a four year fixed term.
PRIME MINISTER:
I'm certainly in favour of four years. I'm not in favour of a fixed term. My preference would be to have a maximum of four, rather than three, with a requirement that the parliament serve at least three years. So you have a minimum of three, maximum of four, with flexibility in that last year. That's my preference. You need a change to the Constitution.
SAUNDERS:
And it failed last time.
PRIME MINISTER:
Yes. And it shouldn't be assumed, incidentally, that the public necessarily want longer parliaments. When you're in Government, you normally want them a bit longer, and when you're in Opposition you want them as short as possible. Accountability, regular accountability, particularly of the national Government, is very important.
SAUNDERS:
Is that guaranteed by the length of parliament though?
PRIME MINISTER:
No.
SAUNDERS:
No.
PRIME MINISTER:
No. I think the greatest problem we have at the present time is that we, because of the voting system and the way in which things fall out in the Senate, it's very hard for the Government of the day, particularly on our side of politics, even if it is elected with a mandate, to do something. And I think of the unfair dismissal laws which we've taken to the country on several occasions, but can't get them through the Senate. And the only way you can hope to get through the Senate is the sledgehammer device of the double dissolution, and that is a very drastic way of trying to get legislation through. I've put up some proposals to the Labor Party in relation to that, but that would require an amendment to the Constitution, and they imposed some conditions that I thought were unreasonable. But in the end, in a democracy people like regular accountability, but you would have better government if we had longer parliaments because all governments on occasions do things that have a short-term political unpopularity, but have a longer term benefit, and the shorter the parliament, the greater the discouragement to do those sort of things.
SAUNDERS:
(inaudible) a term, once we start getting into this phoney election campaign...
PRIME MINISTER:
Well it happens every time. This is no different. It always happens when you get into the last year, the last six months of a Government. I haven't encouraged speculation about a particular date. When I've finally resolved when I believe the election should be, I will go and see the Governor General and advise him for a dissolution. But I haven't encouraged speculation about a particular date. But obviously I have to keep saying that I haven't decided because that is the case and until I have decided, I can't say any more. And people can parse and analyse everything I'm saying and look into my eyes and try and get some kind of nuance, some kind of inflection or intonation in the voice. I wish them well.
SAUNDERS:
Does it cause you any concern that other entities start to be drawn into this is causing them concern? If there's talk about the effect on interest rates, whether it may see an increase coming in December...
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I don't know that speculation will push up interest rates. A change of government will push up interest rates. Every Labor Government we've had in the last 25 years, be it Whitlam, Keating or Hawke, has presided over higher interest rates, and I have no doubt that if Labor wins this election, interest rates will go up because they followed policies that push up interest rates. But speculation about an election date, of itself, doesn't have any impact on interest rates. Interest rates in this country are very, very low. They are at historical lows. The low interest rates, more than anything else, have fuelled the economic strength of Australia, and the biggest immediate sort of relevant economic issue in this election campaign is which party is most likely to deliver lower interest rates.
SAUNDERS:
Is it that simple though? We do tend to talk about and follow the US markets. Every time we speak to our finance correspondent, we look at what's happening in America and the possible flow on here. Is it possible that just purely Government policy would put us that out of kilter with national...
PRIME MINISTER:
Our policies are actually quite different from America. To start with, we have a budget surplus. The Americans have a budget deficit. I mean I don't agree with the economic policy that has been followed by the administration in America as far as the deficit is concerned. I don't. And they drove interest rates down to almost zero because their economy was more recessed than ours. Now the American economy does affect Australia. It affects every economy in the world because it's such a powerful economy. But we have been able to weather the American downturn, we were able to weather the Asian downturn, because we have an independent strength and resilience all of our own. But obviously if America were to go into a prolonged recession, that would affect every country in the world because the American economy is so strong.
SAUNDERS:
If economies can be strong and can act independently of (inaudible) economies, then why can't the Tasmanian Government claim credit for the strength of the Tasmanian economy independent of the national...
PRIME MINISTER:
Because Tasmania is part of Australia. We're not part of America. There's a big difference. The economic policies and the budget policies that are followed by the Federal Government affect all parts of Australia. Now, my argument is that the Tasmanian economy is strong essentially because the national economy is strong. I'm not saying that some individual actions by the Tasmanian Government doesn't have an effect, but overall if the national economy is doing well, most parts of the country benefit, and I'm delighted that the Tasmanian economy is now doing so much better. Now that's due to national economic prosperity, it's due to some particular policies that we have followed. I think the stability brought by the Regional Forest Agreement has helped, and there has been a boom in tourism. Now I'm not saying that some individual actions of the Tasmanian Government haven't made a contribution, but this idea that the Tasmanian economy has grown in strength independently of the national economy is just completely misplaced.
SAUNDERS:
There's even a revelation today that an American Army investigation has censured Major George O'Kane, as if his... for the response to warnings about prisoner abuse at Abu Ghraib, and the reports today indicate there are further questions about the assurances given by our Government, this Government, that Australia did everything they could to make life better. Are there more questions that need to be answered? Is it time to hear from Major O'Kane himself?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well Louise, I've spoken to Senator Hill about this, or my office has, and he's getting a full briefing from the Defence Department on these American reports, and until we have that, we won't be saying anything. We'll just find out precisely what's involved, and that will happen soon and then Senator Hill will have something to say.
SAUNDERS:
But just going back to an earlier issue on this, and that is the prevention of Major O'Kane giving evidence. Was it a political decision to stop Major O'Kane giving evidence?
PRIME MINISTER:
We've sought a briefing on this report and until we've got a briefing, we're not saying anything further.
SAUNDERS:
You said last night that in the Opposition's current tactics in the lead up to the election, there's a sense of desperation. What do you refer to in that?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well they're just talking about the past. The Australian people want to hear from me and my opponent about the future. This election campaign should be about which side of politics can offer Australia a better future, not arguing about issues that have been done to death relating to events that have occurred years earlier. I think the public wants to move on and to talk about the future. They want to know which party is more likely to keep the interest rates down, they want to know which party is more likely to deliver a balanced approach with the environment, which party is likely to challenge... to deal with the great challenge of an ageing population, which party is better able to deliver affordable health services, choice in education. They're the things that the public is interested in, and I can understand that because it's their future and it's the Australia of the next 10 years that should be the subject of the election campaign, not debates of the last few years.
SAUNDERS:
So things such as trying to play an election on credibility not (inaudible) to the Australian people for a start?
PRIME MINISTER:
Look, the Opposition will, you know, say what it wants to say. I will talk about the future because that is what I'm seeking a mandate to handle. I'm seeking a renewed mandate to lead Australia into the future, not to debate the past.
SAUNDERS:
The report in today's paper again about a Sydney software company, one of the directors of which is your son, and various Liberal Party election material being sent out. Have you paid directly yourself to fund this campaign Prime Minister?
PRIME MINISTER:
Yeah well I have, because it's being sent out in my name as the Member for Bennelong, and although it may... it's not strictly necessary, I knew that some suspicious minds would allege because my son was involved... and I paid for it out of my own pocket.
SAUNDERS:
Can you say how much you've paid?
PRIME MINISTER:
No, that's my business because it's not public money, it's private Howard money, and I don't intend to disclose that because it's a private matter. But I'm very proud of the fact that my son has started a small business. He's in his 20s and I get a real buzz out of the fact that he's prepared to have a go in a small business. That's what the future of this country is all about.
SAUNDERS:
As the Member for Bennelong, is it something that you'll tell the party about? It seems that they weren't aware of it.
PRIME MINISTER:
Oh yes, they were fully aware of it.
SAUNDERS:
And are they aware of how much money you've paid for this?
PRIME MINISTER:
The New South Wales Division is, yes.
SAUNDERS:
Okay. Prime Minister, we'll just take a break. We will take some calls. It's a quarter past nine on 936 ABC Hobart and ABC Northern Tasmania.
[break]
SAUNDERS:
On ABC Northern Tasmania and 936 ABC Hobart, 16 minutes past nine. Just making some technical adjustments. We will take some calls from listeners Prime Minister. And we have Tom firstly, who wants to ask about illegal immigration. Hello Tom.
CALLER:
G'day. Good morning Prime Minister. I'm concerned about illegal immigration. On A Current Affair with Ray Martin last week, you said that your Government has quote 'stopped illegal immigration coming to this country', but in reality there are an estimated 60,000 illegal immigrants in Australia, many of them working illegally. The Australian newspaper also reported this week that two companies have allegedly operated migration scams, but were awarded contracts worth nearly $1 million by a federal government agency and more generally the immigration department does not even attempt to prosecute companies that flout immigration regulations which I think is outrageous. Prime Minister, your Government has made a big song and dance about asylum seekers who technically are not illegal immigrants anyway but you have done very little to stop the vast majority of illegal immigrants who...
SAUNDERS:
Question Tom, question.
CALLER:
...and work here illegally. Why don't you do what Mark Latham has promised to do and prosecute employers who abuse the migration process and who employ illegal immigrants and aren't you a liar and hypocrite when it comes to the issue and illegal immigration?
PRIME MINISTER:
I think you'll be voting Labor.
SAUNDERS:
I think that could be (inaudible) question. If you can keep your questions short, we've got limited time with the Prime Minister so the shorter the question the better the chance he'll have to answer it. Graeme Alexander, a doctor from Claremont Prime Minister.
CALLER:
Prime Minister, to introduce myself last year again on A Current Affair I made a plea to you on behalf of more 100 GPs in Hobart to address the crisis in our healthcare system.
PRIME MINISTER:
I think I do remember that, yes.
CALLER:
Since that time you replaced Senator Patterson with Mr Abbott and since that time we have had further haphazard health policy making of a political policy, not a health policy. In this state our health system is in absolute crisis in every section, our major teaching hospital on the verge of collapse, our medical school on the verge of losing accreditation. Mr Howard you recently said while touring Trish Worth's electorate a vote for you was a vote for experienced and decisive leadership. The healthcare needs your help now, will you help?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well doctor I do remember that. Can I point out to you that the major responsibility for the healthcare system in this state is that of the state government and unless we close the federation down and basically get rid of states and hand everything over to the Federal Government there has to be a point at which states accept some responsibility. We have put a lot more resources into...
CALLER:
(inaudible).
PRIME MINISTER:
No, no, could I, I listened to your question. We have put a lot more resources into Medicare and those new resources are yielding results, we'll have some bulk billing figures coming out later today, and it will be very interesting to see what those figures indicate. But the Medicare safety net is providing a lot more protection for Australian families. Your listeners should know that 60 per cent of the Tasmanian budget comes from the Goods and Services Tax and Federal Government payments. Now in those circumstances I am entitled and any Prime Minister of Australia is entitled to look to state governments to discharge their responsibilities and if they're not willing to do so then it's about time they said so and handed responsibility over to somebody else. Now I'm evading my responsibilities, my responsibilities as Prime Minister are to deal with Medicare, to strengthen it which we've done, to adequately fund the private health insurance area and we've announced an increase, an additional rebate, for a million older Australians which the Labor Party is opposed to. And we have tried very hard in the time that's gone by. I know there are deficiencies since we had that discussion, I know there are deficiencies in the state hospital system here but there has to come a point where there's some acceptance of responsibility by the state government. Otherwise what is the point of having state governments?
CALLER:
Mr Howard, I can agree with you on one thing that the performance of our state government in saving our hospital has been abysmal...
PRIME MINISTER:
Cause we don't run them.
CALLER:
... lack of leadership. But Mr Howard, my patients and their diseases don't have the luxury that politicians have of saying that's state or that's federal. If you look at our local hospital the interface between general practice, we can't access that hospital. - general practice is your responsibility, nursing home, inadequate (inaudible) federal responsibility, the collapse of our medical school is your responsibility, the deficiency in the number of doctors has been as a direct consequence of you slashing the number of medical students in...
SAUNDERS:
We need a chance for the Prime Minister to respond Graeme.
PRIME MINISTER:
Could I just point out doctor that in the last budget we put about $2.9 billion into nursing homes, into aged care. And I have been told by aged care providers all around Australia, including as recently as last night here in Hobart, that it was seen as the greatest single budget in living memory as far as aged care in this country is concerned. We have in our strengthening Medicare package introduced through the practice nurse programme and also the additional 1600 places in different ways that we are inducing or funding tried to get more doctors. You know that by the introduction of the $7.50 additional rebate for medical practitioners who bulk bill, bulk bill children under 16 and concession card holders, that that will act as a very powerful additional incentive and will do quite a bit to address the interface between doctor availability and bulk billing, because you know as a medical practitioner that there's a direct link between bulk billing levels and doctor supply. In areas of Australia where there are lots of doctors bulk billing rates are high, in areas of Australia where there aren't many doctors bulk billing rates are lower.
SAUNDERS:
Thanks Graeme. Just a question to from a listener that's come in by phone Prime Minister, we've seen policies to put GPs and doctors into rural areas, someone's asking about more policies putting dentists into rural areas in Tasmania.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well there are different ways in which that can be achieved and we'll probably have something to say about that in the next few weeks.
SAUNDERS:
Another call, John's in New Norfolk. Good morning John.
CALLER:
Good morning Louise, good morning Prime Minister.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning.
CALLER:
Firstly Prime Minister as a Vietnam veteran let me say that you're doing a great job in the defence Australia, and both in the long and short term. However I would like to point out that our public hospital and aged care systems are in crisis, this appears to be due to a lack of funds. So as a republican I've come up with an idea to save a few dollars, I know we've had a referendum and the majority of the Australian people wish to maintain the monarchy but also there's a large percentage that wish to become a republic and my idea is this - we abandon the separate governor system in each state and centralise the monarchy in Canberra in the office of the Governor General, this would maintain the monarchy. Obviously his staff would have to be increased and I'm sure the huge salaries that the Governors get would employ quite a few public servants and provide a lot of employment there to cope with the signing of all these bills and so forth that they process every week.
SAUNDERS:
Thanks John. We get the suggestion. Prime Minister? It would save money that's for sure.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I mean I have no doubt that if we were starting this country all over again we wouldn't have quite the same structure of government that we now have. We'd have a national government obviously and we'd probably have a larger number of regional governments and not have the existing state boundaries, I don't think there's any doubt about that, I don't think the system we have in Australia works very efficiently. But trying to change it is very hard and my time in office has told me that there's a lot of disfunctionality about the federal system, sometimes its works well, we work well together on stem cell research, we work well together ultimately on water policy. But an issue like health is understandably vexing to the public because you take public hospitals, we don't run them, we contribute as much money to the running of public hospitals in Tasmania as does the Tasmanian Government yet we have no say over how they're run. Now that's just a fact of life and when anything goes wrong state governments always blame the Federal Government because it's easy to do and there's an image in the community that the Federal Government has got a pile of money and can solve every problem with that. The reality is that the states have never been better off because they get all of the GST and the GST is growing each year with the economy.
SAUNDERS:
1300 36 1700 we've got a few more minutes to speak with the Prime Minster, Brian is in Launceston Prime Minister.
CALLER:
Good morning Prime Minister.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning.
CALLER:
Prime Minister, I get upset when I hear people turning around keeping saying nothing's been done about aged care. I believe that your Government has done the most on aged care that I've seen and I was associated for 25 years. Your Minister, Julie Bishop, has turned around and been able to rebut the arguments put up by this group in Tasmania that continually attacks over aged care. What I'm concerned about Prime Minister, I want to talk about the forgotten people in these retirement villages who, Senator Newman and I used to call them the forgotten people, and she did something about them with turning around, making funding available so that they could turn around and gain the highest rent assistance. And this enabled units to be done up and turning around and attracting donations and a lot of these donations were of say forty or fifty thousand and they're not taxable but they're supposed to be spent back on upgrading the older units. Now we have an impotent state government that seems not to do anything about it and I think that the Federal Treasurer, Peter Costello, was trying to do something about it with the charities bill and on the definitions of the charities bill and I think that we need to look at that and have some strength because you provide over 60 per cent of Tasmania's government funding...
SAUNDERS:
The question Brian?
CALLER:
Well the question is that I think that we've got to look at these charities who are posing as charities and not providing the service to the residents. And we have similar ones in private enterprise Prime Minister that are out there and they're paying the taxes where these charities are not.
PRIME MINISTER:
Yeah, I see, I see. Well that's a very technical and vexed issue and we have tried to do something about it, and we have made some changes. But one of the difficulties in an area like this is that once a practice becomes entrenched and a service becomes provided on the basis of a particular taxation arrangement, a big change to that causes a great deal of dislocation and also can have some employment and cost implications. And I suppose the confusion or mix between organisations that perform a semi-charitable or semi-public benevolent purpose or function and those that are regarded in a traditional sense as charities adds to the complexity of the issue. It's very technical as I think you and I and the listeners would agree and we have tried to make some changes and we continue to see if other changes can't be made. But they shouldn't be such as to cause an enormous amount of dislocation.
SAUNDERS:
Thank you for that Brian, Caroline is a candidate in Bass for the Citizens Electoral Council, Caroline Lana. Hi Caroline.
CALLER:
Good morning Louise, good morning Mr Howard.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good morning.
CALLER:
I was shocked and horrified with the statement that it's the truth Mr Howard that we have a strong economy. I nearly fell over with astonishment when you announced that at the business forum in Hobart. Here we have a take down in our real psychical economy, we are exporting our primary and secondary industries, our raw materials are going out lock, stock and barrel since deregulation and there go our job opportunities as well, hence the lack of revenue for our poor old hospitals and schools. In the last 40 years we have had no major infrastructure projects, and of course the jobs that go with that and the ability for small to medium business to tap into the affordable water and power, our foreign debt in your reign has gone from $160 billion to $370 billion...
SAUNDERS:
Question Caroline please, we are running out of time.
CALLER:
Alright very quickly, I'm just wanting you to define the term the economy, what do you...
PRIME MINISTER:
Well we have a strong economy because our growth has been consistently strong, our unemployment has fallen to a 24 year low, our inflation rate is below three per cent, we have a very low national debt, when I became Prime Minister 35 federal electorates in Australia had double digit unemployment, that is now four, our revenues are rising because we have a strong economy, the states are getting increased revenue through the GST, they have adequate money to spend on government schools and public hospitals and they should be made accountable because they have the additional resources, all of the GST revenue goes to the states, by any measure the Australian economy is one of the strongest in the world. You say there's been no major infrastructure project. The Darwin to Alice Springs Railway, the Auslink package of road funding, about $11 billion, announced by John Anderson a few months ago, I think double the size of the Snowy Mountains scheme in contemporary dollars. I mean the argument that we are not a strong economy is really, with great respect, preposterous.
SAUNDERS:
Thanks Caroline. Prime Minister, callers, we won't be able to take any more calls, we have run out of time there. Prime Minister, I know that you are sporting fan, I just want to ask you finally about the Olympic Games, it's been our greatest success by an Australian team overseas, you received enjoyment from watching it?
PRIME MINISTER:
Yes I have and like a lot of other people are a bit sleep deprived. I think like so often happens the human stories associated with the Games as well as the outstanding performances stand out. Obviously Jana Pittman...
SAUNDERS:
The knee.
PRIME MINISTER:
The knee, I mean that was just something that everybody lived with that. And I thought Jane Saville's performance to win the bronze, because I remember how heartbroken she had been in Sydney and those two stories, the human side of those two stories, without taking anything away from Ian Thorpe and Grant Hackett...
SAUNDERS:
We almost expect them...
PRIME MINISTER:
Yeah, well that's unfair, they are wonderful athletes and wonderful representatives of Australia. But those two performers, because of the drama associated with the lead up, I remember I think in Sydney four years ago when Jane was...
SAUNDERS:
It was so cruel wasn't it...
PRIME MINISTER:
So...bang... and that was the end of it, all that training just gone completely by the board. So I particularly rejoiced in that and I particularly, you know, (inaudible) as everybody was about Jana Pittman's getting there. I mean I would never have thought watching her come down the steps of that hospital in London that she had a hope of doing it. So good luck if she's now going to do flat racing, good luck to her in the future, I hope it works.
SAUNDERS:
Absolutely. Prime Minister, I hope we will see you again during the election campaign, and for callers who didn't get through with questions today perhaps we can pick those up at another time. Prime Minister, thanks for your time.
PRIME MINISTER:
Thank you.
[ends]