Brisbane
KING: Prime Minister, good morning and welcome to 612 ABC Brisbane.
PM: Good morning Madonna.
KING: Kevin Rudd wanted a job in your Cabinet. He's served as Prime Minister. Why did you say no?
PM: I thought the appropriate thing at this time, Madonna, was for me to make my Cabinet arrangements so that there was a maximum steady-as-she-goes for the Government. We've got a lot of work to do. We've got a lot of work to do to get the Government back on track. We've got a lot of work to do to renew our focus on a strong economy and good services.
KING: But if you -
PM: For Kevin, I thought the appropriate thing was for him to have an opportunity for a bit of rest and recuperation. There's nothing about this time period that's been easy for Kevin Rudd.
KING: No, but if he wanted to serve, and you're looking for steady-as-she- goes and, and, why not acquiesce to his request to stay in the Cabinet before the election?
PM: Well I thought the appropriate thing was for Kevin to get an opportunity for a bit of time out. I mean, he's a man who's worked unbelievably hard, unbelievably hard. And then of course if we are re-elected - and Madonna, I'm not taking anything for granted, it's going to be a close, tough contest - but if we are re-elected then I will be absolutely delighted to see Kevin Rudd serve in a senior role in the Government.
KING: Is it that you want to just put a little bit of space between that, the Rudd Government, and the Gillard Government? That the polls, the voters are saying they want something slightly different, and this is a better way of doing that?
PM: Well Madonna, I can't explain it to you more than I just have. They are the factors that drove my decision. I did want to make sure that the team could be working, stable. Overwhelmingly of course people have stayed in the same positions doing the same jobs. I wanted to achieve that. And for Kevin I thought the best thing was a bit of a rest and, you know Madonna, if we're re-elected - so I'm not taking anything for granted, and I always feel slightly uncomfortable talking about Ministerial arrangements for the day beyond the election, because people might think that's taking the election for granted -
KING: Alright -
PM: And I certainly don't do that -
KING: But there are some -
PM: I would want to see Kevin Rudd serving in a very senior role.
KING: And we'll come more to that in just a moment. You sat as part of his senior management team when the talk was about a big Australia, this mining tax. You now say you'll offer a slightly different direction. Is that, did you disagree with Kevin Rudd at the time? Or is the slightly different direction determined by the voters via the polls telling you they want a different direction?
PM: I was vice-captain of the team and so I take my fair share of responsibility for the good things and the bad things. Madonna, I'm not going to canvass the kind of advice that I gave Kevin in conversations when he was Prime Minister, or the kinds of things I said round the Cabinet table.
KING: But with respect, don't voters deserve to know how you stood, whether you argued against them or whether you simply said yes and went out and sold them with a straight face, but really didn't agree with them or not?
PM: Well Madonna, I think voters want to know where I stand. And I've made that clear. I don't agree with saying we want a big Australia and hurtling towards a population target like 40 million. I think we do need to take the time to, you know, take a breath, get a sense of how we want to manage our population. And I get to travel widely round this country. And you know, there are very different needs in parts of Queensland, obviously Brisbane, Gold Coast there's been spectacular growth with all the stresses and strains that come with that and people would be very anxious about further intensive growth. And then you go to somewhere like Karratha or even further north in Queensland and they're crying out for workers. So we've got to get the balance right.
KING: Alright. You used the word 'hurtling' toward a big Australia. But the 36 million dollar [sic] figure is actually a Treasury projection based on current growth figures. How are you going to stop that 'hurtling'?
PM: Well, what I've done is I've asked Tony Burke to develop the set of policies here, and people say well, what's changed by changing the title to Sustainable Population? Well, it's a question of what you put at the centre of the decision-making here. And I've put at the centre of the decision-making the environmental concerns that flow from increased population and the community concerns that flow from needs for infrastructure, buses, trains, roads, freeways, how suburbs are going to work, how hospitals are going to cope, put that at the centre of the decision-making.
KING: But wasn't Tony Burke's brief always to develop a sustainable population policy?
PM: His brief was to be developing a population policy, and I've said to him as Prime Minister I'm setting a new direction, I'm not endorsing the big Australia approach. I've said to him, Tony when -
KING: But what is a big Australia?
PM: - when you do this work, front and centre of everything you do needs to be this emphasis on sustainability.
KING: And that wasn't the emphasis under his previous brief?
PM: Well clearly, by changing the title we've changed the substance, and how I want this work done.
KING: Alright, but what is a big Australia? Would you consider 36 million a big Australia?
PM: Well I think that's exactly the wrong place to start the debate, which is why I didn't endorse the words big Australia. The right place to start the debate is what is in our national interest, and what best meets our needs and work from there.
KING: Will voters know before an election whether your concern is over the number of migrants coming to Australia, or whether it's the amount of children Australians are having in terms of that growth factor?
PM: Well, Australians are going to make their decisions about kids based on their family circumstances and, you know, all of the things that make a life and make the life choices that women and men around this country make.
On immigration, Madonna, I'm a migrant. How did I get here? Well, the Australia of 1966 said it wanted more people, and my parents were the kind of people it wanted. Hopefully Australians have concluded they did pretty well on the deal, they gave us the ten pounds, or we paid the ten pounds to get here, they paid the rest of the costs. I hope people think they've done alright on the deal. But that's the kind of thing we need to work through.
KING: So do you have a view in terms of our immigration make-up, on whether we're accepting too many business migrants or too many families, too many asylum seekers? Or do you feel strongly about one of those categories?
PM: I feel strongly that business needs to be able to get access to skilled workers after this nation has done everything it can to generate those skills at home.
What I don't want to see is us going into the next decade with youth unemployment rates in some parts of this country at 10, 12, 14 per cent, whilst at the same time business figures say to me 'we can't get skilled workers'.
KING: Are we saying too many asylum seekers?
PM: Well, the number of refugees that come to this country has been steady for a long period of time now. Under the Rudd Government, under the Howard Government, the number has effectively been the same. Obviously, the concerns about asylum seekers are the concerns people feel when they see boats intercepted at sea. And I understand those concerns. I mean, Australia is our sanctuary. It is our home. We do want to manage our borders. We do want to make sure -
KING: It's a tiny part, though, isn't it, of the migrants we're taking?
PM: Oh certainly, the number is steady and it is not a big part of the intake. You're absolutely right there Madonna.
KING: You're coming to Brisbane tonight, is that right?
PM: Yeah, I am coming to Brisbane to fulfil a commitment I had before all of these events Madonna, a commitment to our Member, Yvette D'Ath, so I will be in Brisbane for that.
KING: And is it right you're charging $5,500 a head for mining types and other business people to come and have an exclusive dinner with you?
PM: The event I've got with Yvette D'Ath tonight is an event including party members and Labor supporters. I'm not 100 per cent of the confident of the cost Madonna, but I understand it's in the order of $40.
KING: $40, not $5,500 a head as we've been told?
PM: Ah look, the event I'm having tonight with Yvette D'Ath is a commitment I had before I became Prime Minister, and as I understand it, she's got a party members, personal supporters style event.
KING: Okay, we'll follow that up there. Just on the mining tax -
PM: Madonna, you may be referring to some other event, but that's the event I've got tonight.
KING: Alright, is there another event you have in Brisbane where mining executives and business groups have been asked for $5,500 a head?
PM: Madonna, obviously the ALP does - including in Queensland - does engage in fundraising, including fundraising with businesspeople. But I do want to be clear, what I'm doing tonight is more -
KING: But do you know of this other event?
PM: Look Madonna, I believe I will be in Queensland later in the week for another event associated with Queensland Labor. I don't have all of the details here with me of who's coming. But I can certainly say to you tonight - sorry, say to you today- that the event of tonight is as I've described it.
And in terms of people getting to put a view to me, I'm someone who tries to make sure that they listen and consult and learn from people. As Minister for Education, if I can just use examples there, I've done that in a variety of ways, including having for example Principals' Forums around the country where people just come and get their say.
KING: Alright, I appreciate your time this morning. Prime Minister, thank you.
PM: Thanks Madonna.