BEAUMONT: Prime Minister Kevin Rudd is in our city at the moment and he joins me on the morning program this morning. Prime Minister, good morning to you.
PM: Good morning, Simon. Thanks for having me on your program. You've had some rough weather over here.
BEAUMONT: We have, and we're still clearing it up as best we can. Mr Rudd, can I ask you, we posed this question yesterday on our program and our listeners were asking, were wondering, why do we need 35 million people in this country by 2050?
PM: Well, what has happened with the Intergenerational Report, which is put out by the Commonwealth Treasury every several years or so, is they've just projected ahead where natural population growth would go to over the next 40 years. In fact, two of these were put out earlier by Peter Costello. And that's just based on natural fertility rates and our historical rates of migration. In fact, the population growth projected for Australia for the next 30 or 40 years is less than what we've had for the last 30 or 40 years.
So the key challenge for us, though, given that's what the projections are, is how do we as a nation prepare for that in terms of infrastructure, in terms of planning for our cities, and all those other practical things which need to be done.
BEAUMONT: In your view, is that too many? Can we manage that population growth somehow? Can we manage immigration growth somehow?
PM: Well, you know, the bulk of all this growth comes from natural fertility rates in the country and the projected migration rates for the future are basically where they have been under the previous Howard Government as well, and, as I said, going back a long period of time.
Your question is can we accommodate all that by way of infrastructure and the other services necessary. You know, what it means, Simon, is actually having proper planning for our infrastructure needs, whether it's schools, whether it's hospitals - and I'm here in the west talking about health and hospitals at the moment - but physical infrastructure like roads and the rest as well. If we don't do that then the answer to your question is no, we can't, but if we plan properly then we can make sure that we've got the facilities to accommodate a bigger population - but you know something? You've just got to be realistic about this. This population has been growing over the last 40 years at a pace of knots greater than what's projected for the next 40 years.
BEAUMONT: But we do know, and the United Nations published these figures yesterday, that there's been a spike in the number of people trying to seek asylum in Australia. You know that. We're in an election year now. It is an election issue for a lot of people. A 29 percent spike in immigration claims in Australia. The UN told us that yesterday. In the rest of the world it's stabilised. Do you see, or do you foresee, that we need to better manage immigration intake? Do we need to reduce it?
PM: Well, I think what you saw with Chris Evans on the migration intake for skills last year was a reduction from what we had before, and that was a correct move given what was happening with the global financial crisis last year. What we try and do with the migration intake each year is make sure that it's matched as best we can to the skills needs of the economy, and that differs right across the country.
Migration intake virtually doubled during the period of the Howard Government each year, and they were responding to their analysis of the skills needs at the time. Because of the circumstances last year, Chris Evans, the Minister, cut it back. For the period ahead we've got to be very mindful of where the pressures still exist in the economy for more skills.
This is always a year-by-year proposition depending on where we're at, what skills we need, and what we aren't able to generate locally, but the key thing is this - to make sure we're properly prepared for our workforce and on top of that for the other needs, like infrastructure that you mentioned before.
BEAUMONT: Do you acknowledge that border protection is an election issue for people, and will you change your Government's, the Labor Government's, border protection policy as the election nears? Will we hear an announcement where you'll make changes?
PM: Well, the first thing I'd say, Simon, in response to your question is that the Howard Government, over the years, had big challenges to deal with as well. In fact, in the period late '90s, early 2000s, you had many, many more people coming to this country by boat than is currently the case. What happens over the years is that it ebbs and flows, depending on what's happening with security around the world.
BEAUMONT: And on our government's policies. Your policy is used as a sales pitch by people smugglers.
PM: If you were to go back over the years you will find that at various times people smugglers have been reported as saying, this is during the period of the Howard Government, that there are ways in which you can get through the system as well. The bottom line is this - to make sure that you're responding to the practical challenges of the time, and when you've got, as we've had in the last six months or so, a civil war in Sri Lanka, obviously, that creates problems across the entire world.
To go back to your earlier point, which I think was based on a report in a newspaper a couple of days ago, this is what the United Nations regional representative, Richard Towle, had to say only recently. He said "I wouldn't say that what's happening in Australia bucks the trend at all. I would say it's entirely consistent..." when you are talking about what's happening more broadly internationally across the rest of the world.
The practical thing is to deal with the challenges as they arise, and that's what we intend to do, and with various people engaged in work to deal with people smugglers in Indonesia. We now have a large number of interruptions of people smuggling ventures by the Indonesians, by the Malaysians and by others.
But you know something? This has been the case for years in the past, and it is a question of how you respond to the challenges that you're presented with each day, each month, each year, such as it's been for the last 30 years, because we've had boats arrive in this country in varying numbers for the last 30 years.
BEAUMONT: On Australia's image overseas and how we are perceived immigration-wise, there's also a red-hot story around this morning, PM, about a kangaroo being used by Tourism Australia to sell Australia to L.A. as part of this annual G'Day USA marketing campaign. I'm sure you're aware of that. Have you seen the footage of the kangaroo in the cage on the L.A. street?
PM: No, I haven't, but I've read some reports of it this morning. My first reaction is it sounds pretty off to me. It sounds really off, but I'm waiting for some further details on this in terms of what's actually gone on here, but I think we in Australia have an interest in ensuring that we are properly represented around the world. As I said, based on the reports it sounds pretty off to me, but I'd like to get to the bottom of it first.
BEAUMONT: Sure. It seems it's footage from January that's been taken by someone in the street. And I guess our listeners-
PM: I just want to get to, as you understand Simon, I just want to make sure of all the facts surrounding something first. So I think it sounds pretty off to me, and I think most people would find it that way, but I'd much rather establish what has actually has gone on here.
BEAUMONT: PM, you said a couple of weeks ago on Sydney radio, I heard the comments that you hadn't had an opportunity to read the Henry review, the Ken Henry review of our taxation system as yet. You'd read an executive summary. Have you got around to reading it as yet, and will we expect an announcement around budget time or before the election, on taxation reform?
PM: The answer to your question is yes, I've been through it. But you understand that I've been pretty preoccupied with health and hospitals reform in recent months, and I think that's of big interest to your listeners as well. On the question of the independent review of taxation, as the Treasurer said the other day, we will make sure that's out there by the time of the Budget. The Budget's due in May. And because it obviously involves a whole lot of complex tax questions, we just want to make sure that we've got our response to it as well developed as possible. But my preoccupation, frankly, since the beginning of the year, is to do work on health and hospitals reform, and to deliver better health and better hospital services for working families, pensioners, carers, right across the country, including here in the West, which is why I'm here.
BEAUMONT: You met with our Premier, Colin Barnett yesterday. Do you get on alright with Colin?
PM: Yeah, yeah, no, we've had many conversations now over the last year or so that he's been in office. We've cooperated well on a whole range of areas, like the investment we're making together with the state Government in the Ord, the Ord expansion, the investment we're making with the state Government at Oakajee in terms of the port expansion here in the city of Perth at Northbridge, but also in our hospital investments as well. Already we're putting investments of $180 million into the Midland area Hospital. And also $255 million into the state rehab centre at the Fiona Stanley Hospital. But health and hospitals is certainly the big agenda for the future.
BEAUMONT: And look, you say, look I know Mr Barnett is a regular guest on our program, he acknowledges-
PM: I'd be surprised if he wasn't, Simon.
BEAUMONT: Yes, that's right. And he acknowledges that the relationship between you and he is amicable and fairly strong. But politically, we see the Newspoll released today and your Labor man here in WA, Eric Ripper not travelling too well, is he. Are you concerned about Labor's stocks in WA?
PM: Oh look, the key thing for all of us is to deliver improvements to health and hospital services for the people of Western Australia. And the people of this state and the people nationwide will make a judgment about whether you've done as well as you can or whether you need to improve. My responsibility is to look at the facts, which is that here in the West and across the nation we look- we are looking at a health and hospital system which, if it's not attended to, is at tipping point, and could break. State Governments, if you go out over the next twenty or thirty years, don't have the finance to be able to fund the future needs of the health and hospital system. That's why we're stepping up to the plate in order to provide a national health and hospital network, funded nationally, run locally, but for the first time with the Australian Government being the dominant funder of the system.
So, that's what I was talking to Colin about yesterday, and we've been working through the details of it. It's not as if we're just landing here without having done anything on health already. Remember, at the end of '08 we agreed to a 50% increase in the Australian Government's contribution to the states for public hospitals. In WA, that meant a $6.17 billion allocation, which is $2 billion more than under the previous healthcare agreement. So we've been hard at work for the last two years, but what we're now talking about is what we do for the long-term future as well, and I think your listeners, very few of them would say that the current system is working perfectly. We actually need to make improvements, and that's what Colin and I have been talking about.
BEAUMONT: Alright, just one final one if I can Prime Minister, with regards Canberra and the ACT. I know you're from Queensland but you spend a fair bit of time in the ACT.
PM: Because someone decided to put the capital there, Simon. West Australians and Queenslanders I don't think were consulted much on that one.
BEAUMONT: We know, we know where the real action is, don't we PM? The ACT authorities are going to, given we have a concern agreed about binge drinking in Australia, the ACT authorities will introduce a scheme whereby if someone buys a drink for a drunk mate in a nightclub or a pub or a licensed premises, they will be the ones who could face a fine of $550 under liquor reforms being unveiled today in the Capital Territory. What do you think of that idea?
PM: You know Simon, fools rush in where angels fear to tread. And when it comes to what individual states and territories are doing with, you know, individual parts of their liquor licensing rules, that's something which they need to be responsive to their local communities on. And I just would be reluctant to comment there. Binge drinking is a problem across the country. I'm not sure of the stats here in Perth, but certainly when I've been in my own home town of Brisbane, in Sydney, and Melbourne, this is a challenge which is you know, faced by so many families at the moment, and it requires a response both at the personal level, the family level, the policing level, and I've got all sorts of, I've got to say respect for what our friends in Police uniform have to deal with every night on our streets. But for me to comment on, you know, one by-law or another in one city or another, frankly, I think that's best left to others.
BEAUMONT: Alright, I'm going to sneak one more in PM.
PM: Off you go, Simon.
BEAUMONT: The AFL footy season starts tonight. Who do you like for the Premiership this year?
PM: Well there's only one answer to that, you know, Simon. The team called the Lions. And you know, let's just get real here. You'd be a Lions backer, wouldn't you, being from over here?
BEAUMONT: Not at all, they're playing the West Coast this week, so not at all. PM-
PM: I imagine if I was here for the game, that I may be, sort of, an isolated voice in the crowd.
BEAUMONT: I think you would be.
PM: Anyway, it's good to be on your program, and it's good to be back in the West again, and I'll be back again soon.
BEAUMONT: Thanks for talking to our listeners today.
PM: Thanks very much Simon.