E&OE................................................................................................
CASSIDY:
Prime Minister, welcome.
PRIME MINISTER:
Good evening Barry.
CASSIDY:
Is this new package fairer than the original?
PRIME MINISTER:
I thought the original one was fair. We've added a lot of compensation,
and food's been taken out. I've always preferred to have
food in. I've never really accepted the argument that you make
it fairer by taking something out. However, that's academic because
two weeks ago I learnt that I couldn't get that through and I
decided to get the best I could by negotiation with the Australian
Democrats. And we've ended up with 85% of what we originally
wanted.
CASSIDY:
And something that is considerably fairer surely, because food is
out, the tax cuts remain in toto, the compensation has been boosted.
PRIME MINISTER:
Barry, I'm not unhappy with the outcome. I mean I'm very
happy with it. But I don't accept that the original package was
unfair. I mean whether, you know, [inaudible] of fairness don't
really matter now. I mean the reality is that it's a great outcome
for Australia. And the political system is being seen to work. You've
had a mature approach from the Democrats and I congratulate Meg Lees
on the candid direct business-like ways that the negotiations were
conducted.
CASSIDY:
Because it does say a lot about the political system. The Democrats
in the end delivered. They weren't a threat to democracy. The
Senate wasn't a hindrance.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well that's a fair observation. And I think quite a bit of, in
sense a bit of the political paradigm has been altered today. You've
seen this huge break through, an agreement between a right of center
Coalition, and the Australian Democrats who have a wide diversity
of views. They're left of the Labor Party on some issues, but
their culture is different. They have a strong commitment to certain
issues, the environment. And this is the most aggressive investment
of resources in the environment for decades. I mean you add it to
our natural heritage boost out of the sale of Telstra, which ironically
of course the Democrats were against. This Government is looking as
though it's got pretty green credentials.
CASSIDY:
You will be facing though, after July, the possibility of a fractured
Democratic party. Is that a problem?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I don't presume to talk about the internal affairs of the
Australian Democrats. That would be quite presumptuous. I think that's
a matter for the Australian Democrats. Look I think when you can bring
off what we've brought off today, the possibility of, you know,
the odd defection in another party is of minor significance.
CASSIDY:
Is it the biggest victory that you've ever chalked up in your
political career?
PRIME MINISTER:
Policy-wise this is the greatest thing that I've achieved, policy-wise,
yes.
CASSIDY:
Is it the greenest thing you've ever done?
PRIME MINISTER:
Probably is, yes.
CASSIDY:
If you look at the list of things the Democrats have listed, it runs
to a full page. It talks about: a greater effort on greenhouse gases;
investment programme for renewable energy, recycling, cracking down
on second hand engines. Are these the sorts of things that you would
have addressed in normal circumstances?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well we have addressed a lot. Not as many as those, and I don't
want to take any credit away from the Australian Democrats. But we
were very happy to do them, and I think there's a lot of support
in the Australian community for environmental, what I call mainstream
environmental concerns. And just remember the Natural Heritage Trust
which invested more than $1 billion in things like tackling salinity
problems, and water pollution and all of those things.
CASSIDY:
To what extent will tax reform suffer generally by having to exclude
food?
PRIME MINISTER:
It would have been better if we didn't have to. I don't
deny that the carving out of basic food will be a lot more complex,
and cause a lot of problems for people involved in the sale of different
items in their shops and their stores. Now, our preference was not
to do that but we couldn't get that up. And I am a realist as well
as an idealist and in the end when I knew I couldn't get that up I
knew that I had to try and work out an arrangement with the Democrats
to see what we could get up and we got up 85 per cent. Now, that's
much better than spitting the dummy and walking away.
CASSIDY:
So there are some losers, perhaps small business who now have to handle
the compliance details here?
PRIME MINISTER:
They would much have preferred an alternative approach. I accept that,
I accept that.
CASSIDY:
Very much so because Peter Costello said that if you adopted this
it would be nightmare on main street for small business.
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, clearly we would have preferred the food in' alternative
but we couldn't get that through the Parliament.
CASSIDY:
What are the changes on diesel fuel? What have you done there?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, essentially reduce the additional incentive for the use of diesel
particularly dirty diesel in the cities. We have pared back the extension
of the exemption under the rebate scheme for off-road use of diesel,
not in relation to farmers or tourism or fishing. And we have increased
the road user charge from 18 to 26. But on the other hand, we have
extended the diesel exemption for rail which will be of particular
benefit say to wheat growers who have to send their crops long distances
to ports for exports. So overall it's a greener diesel package and
there are a lot of incentives for people to use alternative fuels.
CASSIDY:
Will farmers pay more for diesel fuel in this package than in the
original package?
PRIME MINISTER:
No, no.
CASSIDY:
Not a cent more?
PRIME MINISTER:
No, they won't pay any more.
CASSIDY:
So obviously you feel the bush will accept the package?
PRIME MINISTER:
I think it's a very good package for the bush.
CASSIDY:
No difficulty for the National Party to sell this to their constituents?
PRIME MINISTER:
No, no, well, the Liberal Party has a lot of seats in the bush as
well. I mean, the Coalition has a lot of seats in the bush and I have
taken particular care to see that the bush has been looked after because
they don't need...they need help. Things are a bit better. They
have had good seasons but the bush still needs a lot of help and a
lot of understanding. And if we can get a few more markets overseas
prized open and if the Yanks don't keep our lamb out, for example,
things will get a bit better.
CASSIDY:
Now, you have sat there for many hours listening to the Democrats
talk about diesel fuel. Is this pragmatism on your part? Are you persuaded
in any way that diesel fuel should be discouraged, that it is a health
problem?
PRIME MINISTER:
I am persuaded by some of their arguments, yes. It's not totally a
compromise. I mean, there are significant elements on the environmental
front that I felt easy about agreeing to.
CASSIDY:
Now, pensioners. What's in it for them?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, food is out and many would argue that that's a benefit. I mean,
we have our differences on that. But we have guaranteed in real terms
that the four per cent up-front compensation will be preserved for
all time.
CASSIDY:
In the end was that necessary given that food is out?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, the Democrats argued for it. I mean, on a strict economic analysis,
no, but when you're dealing with a potentially vulnerable section
of the community it's always better to be overly cautious.
CASSIDY:
How much revenue will be lost and will you need to make that up in
some other way?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, the net cost from forward estimates on Budget night of all of
these additional measures and changes and everything is in the first
year, $1.4 billion. Now, that's the net cost.
CASSIDY:
Do you try and make that up?
PRIME MINISTER:
No, you don't need to because we have substantial surpluses.
CASSIDY:
Now, Telstra. Are you prepared now to load up the social bonus in
order to win the votes of the two Independents?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, I must say, Barry, I haven't read all the detail of what
the two Independents have said over the last couple of days. I've
been rather preoccupied on taxation. We'd like to get the extra
16 per cent and obviously their views must be paid regard to but there's
no bottomless pit in these things. So you've got to be, once
again, mixing pragmatism and other considerations.
CASSIDY:
It must be tempting. You now know that it's within reach, you
just have to find a few hundred million dollars and you're there.
PRIME MINISTER:
I mean, the national interest would be better served if we could pay
off some more of Labor's debt. So there's obviously a national
interest involved in selling that extra 16 per cent of Telstra. I
think the rest of Telstra should be privatised. I think it's
going to be harder because the Democrats are resolutely opposed to
that and they'll dominate the cross benches after the 30th
of June. But we'll keep trying. It's still our policy. We
still believe in it. I'd like to see Australia free of net debt
in the early years of the next century and we can do that if we were
able to sell the whole of Telstra.
CASSIDY:
Now, as I understand it at the height of it all tonight you had Mal
Colston in your office. What was that all about?
PRIME MINISTER:
He came around to see my Chief of Staff about something which...
CASSIDY:
Encouraging?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well, look, Arthur and I have got to have some further discussions.
CASSIDY:
Now, just finally, Prime Minister, I suppose in the end the proof
of all of this will be in not only the details but the implementation,
if something was to go wrong and you must be slightly nervous
about the possibility given the complexities if something was
to go wrong there's only one major party out there now that is
anti-GST and that's Labor. Can you see a net benefit for them
in the end if this was to start to unravel?
PRIME MINISTER:
Yeah but it's not going to. I mean, I think at the moment the
Labor Party is chained to its irrelevance. And the Labor Party has
just engaged in vituperative negativity over tax reform from the very
beginning. They could have been major players. They could have influenced
the outcome. They have could have pressed the thing. They could have
said to their constituency, we have won benefits for you. Instead
of that they snarled and sniped and write themselves right out of
the play. And I think they will be condemned and will suffer politically
for that.
CASSIDY:
Prime Minister, thanks for your time.
PRIME MINISTER:
Thank you.
[ends]